# CSG2016

**URL:** http://discourse.iapct.org/c/csgnet/csg2016/71.md

[Latest](http://discourse.iapct.org/latest.md) · [Categories](http://discourse.iapct.org/categories.md) · [Tags](http://discourse.iapct.org/tags.md)

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## [About the CSG2016 category](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/about-the-csg2016-category/204)

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**Author:** [@system](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/system)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [February 1, 2020, 11:29am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/about-the-csg2016-category/204 "2020-02-01T11:29:56Z")

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This is an archive of CSGnet posts from 2016.

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## [Power Law re-boot](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/power-law-re-boot/8989)

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**Author:** [@rogerkmoore](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/rogerkmoore)\
**Replies:** 32\
**Last updated:** [June 5, 2020, 10:01pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/power-law-re-boot/8989 "2020-06-05T22:01:42Z")

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\[Roger Moore 2016.09.15.22.12 BST\] THE MATHEMATICS Equation 8 states that the instantaneous velocity V is a function of the first-derivative of any movement decomposed into X and Y coordinate space. This means that V…

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## [Another Behavioral Illusion (was Re: the speed-curvature power law in humans and flies)](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/another-behavioral-illusion-was-re-the-speed-curvature-power-law-in-humans-and-flies/1121)

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**Author:** [@rsmarken](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/rsmarken)\
**Replies:** 34\
**Last updated:** [July 20, 2018, 1:29pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/another-behavioral-illusion-was-re-the-speed-curvature-power-law-in-humans-and-flies/1121 "2018-07-20T13:29:54Z")

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···\[From Rick Marken (2016.07.16.1415)\] There is a considerable body of research aimed at understanding the power law relationship between curvature and angular velocity that is observed when people (or other or…

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## [world model](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/world-model/15443)

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**Author:** [@Angus\_Jenkinson](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/Angus_Jenkinson)\
**Replies:** 65\
**Last updated:** [July 8, 2018, 1:51am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/world-model/15443 "2018-07-08T01:51:56Z")

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From Angus Jenkinson, 2016-06-14.12.16.GMT AJ: I have received some 1000 emails since this exchange, many most interesting, thank you, but I may have missed exactly where the matter was settled and how, but if so I have…

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## [Missing mails](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/missing-mails/7045)

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**Author:** [@MartinT](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/MartinT)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [January 1, 2017, 5:26am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/missing-mails/7045 "2017-01-01T05:26:56Z")

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I think I may have forwarded one of them twice. I'm sure you will spot it, if that's teh case. Happy New Year. Martin ···On 2016/12/31 10:45 PM, Dag Forssell wrote: Martin, How about forwarding them, one at a time?…

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## [Hierarchical network of control systems that learn...](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/hierarchical-network-of-control-systems-that-learn/5238)

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**Author:** [@MartinT](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/MartinT)\
**Replies:** 2\
**Last updated:** [January 1, 2017, 5:25am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/hierarchical-network-of-control-systems-that-learn/5238 "2017-01-01T05:25:29Z")

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Has anyone here seen this work before; that heavily credits Powers (see Discussion) but produce their own 'mixed' model to account for reinforcement learning? \<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A\_\_journal…

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## [Time-stamp ID](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/time-stamp-id/11676)

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**Author:** [@MartinT](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/MartinT)\
**Replies:** 7\
**Last updated:** [January 1, 2017, 5:24am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/time-stamp-id/11676 "2017-01-01T05:24:13Z")

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\[Martin Taylor 2016.12.29.13.28\] Warren, you are in the UK, which is, I think five or six hours ahead of North American Eastern Standard Time. I sent the message to which you are replying with a time-stamp of \[Martin Ta…

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## [Martin please   Missing CSGnet mail](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/martin-please-missing-csgnet-mail/6773)

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**Author:** [@DagArchive](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/DagArchive)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [December 30, 2016, 11:09pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/martin-please-missing-csgnet-mail/6773 "2016-12-30T23:09:57Z")

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\[From Dag Forssell (2016 15:10 PST)\] Martin, just so one person sends me missing CSGnet mail: Will you please redirect to me whatever CSGnet mail appeared after Warren's "Re: Time-stamp ID" (Not sure) and my reappea…

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## [Christmas Present article...](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/christmas-present-article/2540)

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**Author:** [@wmansell](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/wmansell)\
**Replies:** 2\
**Last updated:** [December 25, 2016, 10:28pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/christmas-present-article/2540 "2016-12-25T22:28:47Z")

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Hi CSGers, Here is a teaser for an Open Access paper published with Attention, Perception & Psychophysics in the New Year… Control Blindness Why People Can Make Incorrect Inferences about the Intentions of Others And…

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## [Xmas Joy of CSGNet](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/xmas-joy-of-csgnet/12620)

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**Author:** [@rsmarken](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/rsmarken)\
**Replies:** 1\
**Last updated:** [December 24, 2016, 10:07pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/xmas-joy-of-csgnet/12620 "2016-12-24T22:07:31Z")

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\[From Rick Marken (2016.12.24.1230)\] RM: I’ve been going through the CSGNet archives and though I’ve barely made it through the first 2 years (which are available only in PDF) I’ve already found some nuggets that I thou…

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## [correction of images...](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/correction-of-images/13481)

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**Author:** [@lloydk](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/lloydk)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [December 24, 2016, 12:33am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/correction-of-images/13481 "2016-12-24T00:33:19Z")

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\[From Lloyd Klinedinst (2016.12.23.1833CST)\]

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## [VS: Term ATENFEL? (VS: Stability and Control)](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-term-atenfel-vs-stability-and-control/12029)

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**Author:** [@EetuP](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/EetuP)\
**Replies:** 1\
**Last updated:** [December 22, 2016, 10:06pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-term-atenfel-vs-stability-and-control/12029 "2016-12-22T22:06:53Z")

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\[Eetu Pikkarainen 2016-12-19\] Thank you, very interesting. I think I partially understood. Have you (or Kent) written any more detailed paper or draft about these with more examples and examples about their use in your …

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## [Term ATENFEL? (VS: Stability and Control)](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/term-atenfel-vs-stability-and-control/11113)

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**Author:** [@EetuP](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/EetuP)\
**Replies:** 2\
**Last updated:** [December 21, 2016, 7:59pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/term-atenfel-vs-stability-and-control/11113 "2016-12-21T19:59:45Z")

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\[eetu pikkarainen 2016-12-19\] Please, would you someone kindly give a short introduction to that term of ATENFEL? At least from what word is an abbreviation? I have tried to search if but did not manage to find. Eetu…

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## [Stability and Control (was Re: TCV and Collective Control ...)](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/stability-and-control-was-re-tcv-and-collective-control/10738)

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**Author:** [@rsmarken](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/rsmarken)\
**Replies:** 7\
**Last updated:** [December 18, 2016, 5:58am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/stability-and-control-was-re-tcv-and-collective-control/10738 "2016-12-18T05:58:23Z")

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\[From Rick Marken (2016.12.09.1750)\] ···Erling Jorgensen (2016.12.08 1150 EST) \[EJ\] Rick, I appreciate the archival search you did to find some of Bill Powers’ thoughts on this issue. For one thing, it helps me rel…

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## [Quadbot](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/quadbot/9334)

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**Author:** [@wmansell](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/wmansell)\
**Replies:** 2\
**Last updated:** [December 15, 2016, 6:38pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/quadbot/9334 "2016-12-15T18:38:28Z")

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Check out quadbot - I want one!! https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/engimake/quadbot-real-robotics-made-accessible?token=b7d08c2c ···Dr Warren Mansell Reader in Clinical Psychology School of Health Sciences 2nd Fl…

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## [An study essay on PCT](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/an-study-essay-on-pct/1067)

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**Author:** [@EetuP](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/EetuP)\
**Replies:** 5\
**Last updated:** [December 5, 2016, 7:18am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/an-study-essay-on-pct/1067 "2016-12-05T07:18:20Z")

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Dear list I want to share the first draft of a writing I had to do to digest PCT. Comments and corrections are welcome. I am sorry that here are no proper citations in this version. (and the English is what it is) E…

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## [VS: TCV and Collective Control ...](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-tcv-and-collective-control/12028)

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**Author:** [@EetuP](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/EetuP)\
**Replies:** 1\
**Last updated:** [November 29, 2016, 5:01am UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-tcv-and-collective-control/12028 "2016-11-29T05:01:23Z")

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Hi Rick That is a quite hard claim: ”PCT (and I) take the truth of what is out there to be the current physical model of what is out there.” Could you point where does PCT say so? I think this claim could be called eli…

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## ["Your Behavior" Book by Pfau](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/your-behavior-book-by-pfau/292)

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**Author:** [@FredNickols](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/FredNickols)\
**Replies:** 1\
**Last updated:** [November 28, 2016, 6:29pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/your-behavior-book-by-pfau/292 "2016-11-28T18:29:22Z")

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\[From Fred Nickols (2016.11.28.1044 ET)\] Congratulations, Richard! I hope it does well and makes a difference. Fred Nickols ···From: richardpfau4153@aol.com \[mailto:richardpfau4153@aol.com\] Sent: Monday, November 28…

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## [PCT and dementia](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/pct-and-dementia/8314)

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**Author:** [@wmansell](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/wmansell)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [November 28, 2016, 6:14pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/pct-and-dementia/8314 "2016-11-28T18:14:23Z")

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Hi there, If anyone is interested in this paper, drop me a line on my direct email: Phil McEvoy John Eden Lydia Morris Warren Mansell , (2016),“Dementia: towards a perceptual control theory perspective”, Quality in A…

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## [Tremor spoon](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/tremor-spoon/11766)

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**Author:** [@wmansell](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/wmansell)\
**Replies:** 7\
**Last updated:** [November 26, 2016, 3:46pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/tremor-spoon/11766 "2016-11-26T15:46:13Z")

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http://www.gyenno.com/spoon-en.html Anyone know what algorithms and components these use - to cancel out disturbances and 'distinguish intentional movement'. Could PCT do any better? Warren

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## [VS: An study essay on PCT](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-an-study-essay-on-pct/12000)

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**Author:** [@EetuP](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/EetuP)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [November 24, 2016, 12:05pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-an-study-essay-on-pct/12000 "2016-11-24T12:05:06Z")

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\[eetu pikkarainen 2016-11-24\] Thank you Boris for kind feedback! As for your comments, I was using "at least millions" and "uncountable" synonymously meaning "much more than I can understand at the moment". That use wa…

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## [Input Control Theory (was RE: TCV and Collective Control ...)](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/input-control-theory-was-re-tcv-and-collective-control/5692)

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**Author:** [@FredNickols](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/FredNickols)\
**Replies:** 4\
**Last updated:** [November 22, 2016, 2:46pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/input-control-theory-was-re-tcv-and-collective-control/5692 "2016-11-22T14:46:28Z")

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From Fred Nickols (2016.11.21.0515 ET)\] Regarding the notion of “input control theoryâ€? some doggerel rhyme I published way back in the mid-1970s might be of interest. Here are the opening lines: Things coming in a…

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## [Jay W. Forrester on Open and Feedback Systems](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/jay-w-forrester-on-open-and-feedback-systems/5932)

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**Author:** [@Abbott](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/Abbott)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [November 21, 2016, 5:46pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/jay-w-forrester-on-open-and-feedback-systems/5932 "2016-11-21T17:46:54Z")

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\[From Bruce Abbott (2016.11.21.1245 EST)\] Here is a short passage from Chapter 1 of Jay W. Forrester’s book, Principles of Systems, 2nd preliminary edition (1973). One caution is in order: Forrester is using the word …

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## [Input Control Theory in Finnish](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/input-control-theory-in-finnish/5693)

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**Author:** [@Matti](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/Matti)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [November 21, 2016, 12:49pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/input-control-theory-in-finnish/5693 "2016-11-21T12:49:28Z")

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\[From MK (2016.11.21.1350 CET)\] Eetu Pikkarainen (2016.11.21.1210)-- (I still do not know how I should translate the name to Finnish.) Powersin psykokyberneettinen silmukaninputtistabiilisuusteoria! "Perseptuaaline…

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## [VS: Input Control Theory (was RE: TCV and Collective Control ...)](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-input-control-theory-was-re-tcv-and-collective-control/12015)

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**Author:** [@EetuP](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/EetuP)\
**Replies:** 1\
**Last updated:** [November 21, 2016, 12:10pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-input-control-theory-was-re-tcv-and-collective-control/12015 "2016-11-21T12:10:28Z")

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eetu pikkarainen 2016-11-21 This begs some questions: Is it here, the problem which Boris protests? Input and input quantity are something happening outside the organism, in the boundaries of environment, isn’t it? I…

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## [cars: what is the controlled variable of our perception](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/cars-what-is-the-controlled-variable-of-our-perception/13217)

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**Author:** [@PHILIP\_JERAIR\_YERANO](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/PHILIP_JERAIR_YERANO)\
**Replies:** 1\
**Last updated:** [November 19, 2016, 10:13pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/cars-what-is-the-controlled-variable-of-our-perception/13217 "2016-11-19T22:13:01Z")

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Can someone create the following program: Draw “cars” moving at a velocity, v: v O —\> There is a distance,d, between the cars: d O\>-------|O The velocity depends on this distance: v = f(d) A thought experiment: …

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## [Jay Forrester](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/jay-forrester/5930)

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**Author:** [@FredNickols](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/FredNickols)\
**Replies:** 3\
**Last updated:** [November 19, 2016, 7:15pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/jay-forrester/5930 "2016-11-19T19:15:17Z")

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Jay Forrester has passed away. He was 98. Here’s a snippet from a notice I received from the Systems Dynamics Society. It is with great sadness that we are writing to you to announce that Jay W. Forrester, Professor o…

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## [Jay W. Forrester Dies at 98](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/jay-w-forrester-dies-at-98/5931)

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**Author:** [@chadtgreen](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/chadtgreen)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [November 18, 2016, 2:11pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/jay-w-forrester-dies-at-98/5931 "2016-11-18T14:11:22Z")

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\[From Chad Green (2016.11.18.0911 EDT)\] Jay W. Forrester Dies at 98; a Pioneer in Computer Models http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/11/18/technology/jay-forrester-dead.html Best, Chad

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## [VS: New Video](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-new-video/12022)

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**Author:** [@EetuP](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/EetuP)\
**Replies:** 0\
**Last updated:** [November 15, 2016, 5:08pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/vs-new-video/12022 "2016-11-15T17:08:43Z")

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Warren, could you offer more detailed citation info (book, page) for the Slide 17: Darwin & Wallace? ···Eetu Pikkarainen Lähettäjä: Warren Mansell wmansell@gmail.com Lähetetty: 14. marraskuuta 2016 5:59 Vastaanotta…

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## [New Video](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/new-video/7612)

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**Author:** [@wmansell](http://discourse.iapct.org/u/wmansell)\
**Replies:** 3\
**Last updated:** [November 15, 2016, 4:59pm UTC](http://discourse.iapct.org/t/new-video/7612 "2016-11-15T16:59:39Z")

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Dear colleagues and friends, As prompted by Rob Griffiths, please find the video of my latest talk on YouTube. Comments welcome! Warren https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ3lY1U60MM ···Dr Warren Mansell Reader in Clin…

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