[from Mary Powers 970422.2000 MDT]
Jeff Vancouver:
Here's what I said: "anticipation, expectations, and planning are products
of the program or strategy level in the imagination mode...this level is so
important to some people that they think it's the whole ball game. It isn't."
Here's what you said I said: "anticipation, planning, etc. are examples of
imagination mode and some think that is all there is."
I think that there is quite a difference between the program level and the
imagination mode.
What I was talking about was the tendency of some people to believe that the
mind is almost entirely concerned with anticipation, expectations, planning,
strategies, programs, logic, decisions - that is, to believe that the
program level IS the mind - all there is to the mind, or at least all that
is important. The ability to be logical, to plan, etc., are often thought
of as the highest type of mental function. (In PCT these abilities are not
the highest level, but rather are in service to the principle and system
concept levels).
You were responding to a paragraph from Bill P. about the imagination
connection. In a post to Hans, he was talking about the simplicity of
"internal simulation" in the HPCT model, as opposed to the MCT model,
finishing his comment by saying "complex behavior involves many of these
elementary control systems operating at once, so the overall effect can be
that of a complex simulation of the environment - when many systems are
operating in the imagination mode at the same time."
This seemed to strike a chord with you, as referring to an idea you "have
been trying to pursue". It's a little hard to know what that idea is,
except I very much doubt it has much to do with Bill's and Hans' ongoing
debate about PCT and MCT. However, it seems to have something to do with
the imagination mode, since you then misquoted me as above, omitting my
reference to the program level so that it looks like I was saying "some
think that's all there is" about the imagination mode. Then you added this
comment: "I think one should be careful in mistaking a view that 'that is
all there [is]' with 'this is an area that interests me and where I will
focus my research.'"
So is it the imagination mode that interests you or is it the program level?
In HPCT (at the moment) the imagination mode is possible at any level, and
the program level can operate either in the real time or imagination mode.
Eleven levels, two modes. You say "my point was simply that 'anticipation,
planning, etc' are considered phenomenon that PCT can handle (via the
imagination mode)" - and I say yes, via the imagination mode AT THE PROGRAM
LEVEL. To me, leaving out the level involved invites misunderstanding -
leading to the mistaken notions that the program level is the only place
where imagination happens, or that the only thing that happens at the
program level is imagination, or that the mode and the level are basically
interchangeable.
Finally, you say that I have hurt you with [something] I said. I have
looked at everything I wrote and see nothing hurtful there. Perhaps you
thought that I was confusing your interest in the imagination mode with
thinking that you believe that is all there is? That would be hard to do,
since I was posting to Chuck Tucker, didn't even know you were reading CSG
posts, and was talking about the program level, not the imagination mode.
What did you infer from what I said that made you feel hurt? Why are you
blaming me for how you feel?
Mary P.