[From Kenny Kitzke (980813.0845 EDT)]
<From Tim Carey (980813.1245)>
Thank you for some data about the functioning of RTP in practice. It
should not be difficult for any PCTer to understand why Rick, or me or
anyone who has not personally experienced RTP in action, would have
perceptions about RTP that are merely in their mind, quite apart from any
observable reality.
I also appreciate your tone. It is educational instead of confrontational.
You make a valuable contribution on this forum. Your zeal for PCT is high
gain and contagious.
<The reason the kids get annoyed, in general, is because
they weren't asked the questions period. There are close to zero complaints
from kids who have been through the questionning procedure.
If kids complain at all they are more likely to complain about the first
part of the procedure (where they are asked "What are you doing ...etc")
than the part of the procedure where they are told they have chosen to
leave.>
I would hypothesize that children who accept the two restricted choices
they find as reasonable and acceptable do not experience coercion from the
question, "I see you have chosen to leave and go to the RTC?" Do you agree
with this hypothesis?
When people ask, "What are you doing?" after a class disruption, there is a
perjuritive context that also requires a potentially embarrassing public
acknowledgment. Most people I know resist such treatment.
I tend to agree with you about which teacher statement produces greater
conflict for students. The first question could be changed to "What do you
percieve you are doing?" It strikes me this is truthful and consistent
with PCT and would not detract from RTP. Do you disagree with this
improvement suggestion? What would your bride think of the significance of
this small change in the process?
I know you have agreed that the use of RTP can involve coercion. Your
objection seems to be about characterizing an inanimate system (such as
public education or RTP) as coercive.
I'd like to briefly explain this concept. For me, this comes from the
science of "systems thinking" as taught by W. Edwards Deming, the quality
guru and statistician. Basically, people work in a system. The system
represents the rules or norms that apply to the work (actions) of those
people.
When a system, acting through people in authority, can use its decreed or
usurpted power to enforce the behavior of the people as they desire it to
be, it is a fundamentally a coercive system. This does not mean everything
done in the system is coercive. Teacher RTP action may be cooperative and
helpful to the student as you have pointed out many times to little avail
for those who want to define coercion based on the intention of the coercer
alone.
When a person in authority in the system (teacher, principal, truant
officer) purposely uses this system's power against the will of a student,
I see coercion. If a student knows and accepts that disrupting the class
is against the rules and requires a trip to the RTC, there is no coercion.
The student is simply controlling his own perceptions for what is proper
and doing so willingly.
Let me try an example to see if you can understand "systems thinking." A
compulsory attendence public school system is a fundamentally coercive
system because it can make a child come to school or be otherwise
institutionalized against the will of a student.
My Church system has no ability to make me come to its services. It is not
a fundamentally coercive system. For working in my Church system, I am
free to attend or stay home or go and attend another congregation.
The Church system (pastor, elders and members) do try to encourage, even
intimidate, me to behave the way they want me to: attend services with
them. This is not coercion to me because they cannot use force to make
sure I attend. I go willingly every Saturday unless other perceptions of
mine (feeling sick, attending a 10 year family reunion, etc.,) take
priority. I am a free, autonomous Church system member.
I wish students would attend school, and not disrupt the class, *because
they want to*. We are in a world that perceives differently. I see RTP as
one way of positively changing that world so that more students who want to
can learn more.
But, there are other ways to skin the learning cat. However, these may be
resisted by the people in authority in the school system because they
threaten their reference for control and self-worth, which they may want.
Please keep sharing with us, Tim. Ask all the questions you want.
My best wishes to the newly-weds! Hope there is no coercion yet in the
marriage interaction. 
Kenny