Lessons for Managers

[From Rick Marken (990207.1130)]

Kenny Kitzke (990205.1600 EST) to Bruce Gregory --

as soon as you and Rick discover that I'm right, I am going to
start selling Bibles (possibly give them away) on my PCT business
web site. It sure would beat trying to get managers to accept
Perceptual Control Theory as a basis to operate their organizations.
It has been a very disturbing struggle so far. :sunglasses:

I can see why managers, especially those looking for justification
for the most ruthless and autocratic management practices, would
prefer the Bible to PCT as a source of lessons on management. The
first lesson I learn from the Bible is

1. If one of your initiatives is a major failure, don't learn from
your mistakes, remain firmly in charge and demand continued respect
from those most affected by your failure.

This is precisely what God does in Genesis. Mankind (God's
initiative) proved to be a failure (admitted to by God himself
in Gensis 6:6), so he kills everyone (man, woman and fetus) in
a flood, and starts all over again with the failed components
(Noah et al) while remaining firmly in charge. [Note to Kenny:
How did the kangaroos get from Ararat to Australia after the
flood?]. Things quickly go south with mankind again but God
stays on as CEO, even demanding respect (burnt offerings seemed
to be the big thing at the time) from those who were most adversely
affected by his poor judgement.

Here are some more lessons I picked up:

2. Lie and cheat if necessaary to move up in the world.

This, of course, if what Jacob did in order to get blessed
by upper management. He cheated his brother out of his birthright
as well. Jacob is, of course, the good guy from God's perspective;
since I'm not schooled in the management philosophies of the Bible
it seems to me that Jacob is pond scum while ol' blue collar
Esau is the mensch.

3. Don't negotiate; destroy the opposition!

This is how God (via Moses) delt with Pharaoh. To God's credit,
he seemed to be opposed to slavery -- at least for Hebrews;-).
When God finally gets it into his all powerful agenda to to
free the Hebrews he proceeds by the use of naked force; he
threatens Pharaoh with plagues that will mainly hurt innocent
people. On top of this, whenever Pharoah starts to be inclined
toward giving in and freeing the Hebrews, God "hardens Pharoah
heart" so that God can go on punishing innocent people. Why, in
God's name, God hardens instead of softens Pharoah's heart is
beyond me. The God being described here is punitive (and a killer
of innocent people). God is a strong proponent of war and genocide
as a way to get whatone wants. On the topic of genocide, God makes
this wise observation: "Those that ye let remain [alive] of them
shall be as pricks in your eyes and thorns in your side and shall
vex you in the land wherein ye dwell" (Numbers 33:55) In other
words, make sure you kill everyone (man, woman and fetus) in the
places you take over or eventually someone will come back and
give you problems. Sound's like Microsoft's approach to business
competition. The Christians in Kosovo are also apparently trying
to apply this Biblical management principle in their country.

4. Have lots of rules, whether they make sense or not, and
demand blind adherence to them.

The famous 10 commandments are in Exodus (20:1-17). I hope
they are not listed in order of importance. If so, the second
most important commandment is "Thou shalt not sculpt"; is
sculpting (making graven images) really one of the top offenses
in God's "company"? This will be bad news for my Auntie Natalie
who has several large metal sculptures on display in public
places in LA and Japan. "Thou shalt not kill" is way down on
the list.

I'm afrand that reading this Bible for management or moral
lessons is just not going to work for me. Against the backdrop
of my wimpy, relativist moral references, much about the God
of the Bible strikes me as just plain immoral. For those who
insist on getting their ideas about management and morality
from ancient tribal myths I recommed Homer's epics over the
Torah any day. They are certainly better poetry (though
Ecclesiates and the sexy Song of Solomon give Homer a run for
his money).

Best

Rick

···

--

Richard S. Marken Phone or Fax: 310 474-0313
Life Learning Associates e-mail: rmarken@earthlink.net
http://home.earthlink.net/~rmarken/

[From Kenny Kitzke (990212.1100EST)]

<Rick Marken (990207.1130)>

<Here are some more lessons I picked up:

2. Lie and cheat if necessaary to move up in the world.

This, of course, if what Jacob did in order to get blessed
by upper management. He cheated his brother out of his birthright
as well. Jacob is, of course, the good guy from God's perspective;
since I'm not schooled in the management philosophies of the Bible
it seems to me that Jacob is pond scum while ol' blue collar
Esau is the mensch.>

Again, you leave much of the context of this story out looking for a verse
or concept that you can pick apart and criticize. If you want to resolve
what happened in this Bible story and what it means to believers in God,
you will have to do more study. Here are some points that give a context
that is quite different than your simplistic assumption that God approves
of those who lie and deceive to get ahead in the world.

Here are some points and scriptures you may want to consider before
declaring what the story is about:

* God revealed to Rebekah, while the twins Esau and Jacab were still in her
womb, that they would both become nations but very different people and one
would be stronger and contrary to normal custom, the elder would end up
serving the younger Gen 25:23

This is a prophecy. God planned this in his overall purpose. He has the
right to have mercy on whom he wants. Before the twin boys were born (Esau
first with Jacob holding his heel) God let Rebekah know what was to come to
pass.

This is why she deceived Issac. Issac actually loved Esau more. Had not
Rebekah known God's preference, she would not have deceived Issac with the
bait and switch.

Secondly, we find that while Jacob went along with his mother's plan to
trick Issac, he did not cheat Esau out of his birthright. Esau sold his
birthright to Jacob for a meal. How does that honor Issac? What a fool!
Gen 25: 33-34

In fact, Issac is shocked when Esau shows up. Issac then realizes he gave
the birthright to the one younger, not to the one that was the custom or
the one Issac loved more and whom he intended to bless after eating some of
Esau's savory venison.

It does not appear that Issac knew what had been revealed to Rebekah about
God's predestined plan for the twins. Issac trembled at the deceit but
lets his selection stand. This suggests Rebekah may have explained her
actions to Issac. Notice that after the incident, Issac calls Jocob for
another blessing and a commandment regarding his wife. Issac did bless
both sons. Only the birthright went uniquely to Jacob as God preordained,
not as Issac wanted.

If you read the rest of the story, you will see that the character of Esau
is flawed as well as he immediately plans to kill Jacob for taking the
birthright he already sold to Jacob. All men sin. Those who have an ear
to hear, can also know what will happen to Esau and his land of Edom
compared to the land of Israel as this age draws to a close.

God does intervene in the affairs of his creation for his own soverign
purposes. What man shall stand to tell God, his Almighty Creator, what God
must do based on what the man thinks is important, wanted, desired or that
which seems just to him?

So, your point it pointless. Jacob did not lie and cheat to move up in the
world. That is only how it looks to you. He hearkened to his mother who
loved him which also had God's interest at heart, even above Issac's
desire. Rebekah told Jacob that if there was a curse for deceiving Issac
as she suggested, the curse would be on her. Gen 27: 13 Of course, there
was no risk for her as she was acting on the behalf of God's own will.

Jacob was not praised or rewarded for his trickery. It all had little to
do with Jacob's lies or deceit. Jacob thought Esau sold his birthright to
him for a bowl of porridge.

Christian managers learn that fighting God's plan is quite futile. They
accept his will in life and in their business. Some even become blessed
and rise to the top of the mountain, with or without PCT. God may show
them mercy as he decides. It is not so much management you are not
schooled in, Rick, its the word of God you cannot understand.

best wishes,

kenny

[From Kenny Kitzke (990212.1000EST)]

<Rick Marken (990207.1130)>

<I can see why managers, especially those looking for justification
for the most ruthless and autocratic management practices, would
prefer the Bible to PCT as a source of lessons on management.>

Your perception is totally opposite of mine. Managers who are autocratic
and ruthless are that way because they are PCT controllers. And, they
manage for what they want: wealth, profit, greed, power, etc.

Your characterization of managers is not uniformly true, is it? I know a
CEO of a major public corporation who trys to avoid these selfish type
wants and encourages employees to take responsibility for what they do with
as little control from him as possible.

His only management book is the Bible. He knows nothing about PCT. His
company became the most profitable one in the Pittsburgh Region. This is
the third client that has hit #1 since 1993.

Oh Rick, if you only knew what these God fearing men knew, you could be
famous, successful and respected as the best in your field too.

best wishes,

kenny

[From Kenny Kitzke (990212.1000EST)]

<Rick Marken (990207.1130)>

<The first lesson I learn from the Bible is:

1. If one of your initiatives is a major failure, don't learn from
your mistakes, remain firmly in charge and demand continued respect
from those most affected by your failure.

This is precisely what God does in Genesis. Mankind (God's
initiative) proved to be a failure (admitted to by God himself
in Gensis 6:6), so he kills everyone (man, woman and fetus) in
a flood, and starts all over again with the failed components
(Noah et al) while remaining firmly in charge.>

I find your conclusion is typically Rick cute and self-serving (totally
PCT). You might benefit from a different perception of what is being
taught.

God created man with free will. Man could choose to obey or disobey his
Creator's will for him. When Adam disobeyed, the nature of man changed
drastically. We all still suffer from Adam's original sin.

God punished the sin and disobedience of Adam, Eve and the serpent. He
separated himself from man. Man was put on his own to face the world and
survice. How did man do apart from God? Scripture is clear (this happens
to be NIV which I have on-line).

Gen. 6:5 The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become,
and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all
the time.

Amazing! In the perception of the LORD, man became greatly wicked. So
wicked that every intentional [inclined] thought of his heart [desire] was
evil all the time.

Gen. 6:6 The LORD was grieved that he had made man on the earth, and his
heart was filled with pain.

This grieved the LORD because when he made man, he hoped that man would
choose to obey him and live in a literal pardise. And, Adam and Eve just
might have done just that except for the serpent. The cunning serpent
beguiled and decieved Eve (an early example of how Bill Clinton deceives
Hillary).

Gen. 6:7 So the LORD said, "I will wipe mankind, whom I have created,
from the face of the earth --men and animals, and creatures that move along
the ground, and birds of the air --for I am grieved that I have made them."

In his grievance, God had to destroy the evil that entered his originally
good creation. God cannot coexist with evil, sin and disobedience. God
has the right to destroy what he created that is evil or bad. That is what
managers do with defective products and people. They grieve over them.
They must reject them. It is the righteous thing for both God and managers
to do. Is there anything that bothers you about that?

Gen. 6:8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD.

Your assertion that "[God] starts all over again with the failed components
(Noah et al) while remaining firmly in charge." is false and ludricous.
Noah was not evil. He found favor in God's eyes. He was obedient, and
righteous, just the opposite of the rest of mankind. God did restart his
creation of man project but he chose a new father of all that had proven he
would choose good instead of evil.

Here is documentation:

Gen. 6:9 This is the account of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless
among the people of his time, and he walked with God.

God did not fail. Man failed. God grieved but continued with the good
that survived from his originally good creation: Noah and his family. God
wants all men to be like Noah whom he saved from destruction in the flood.
All men who will not obey, God will destroy.

That is the teaching of this scripture IMHO. Interestingly, man failed God
again and again over the time of his existance on the earth. He kept
punishing them for disobedience. God uses both reward and punishment
righteously. I agree that most managers do not. God does not have the
fallen nature that you think PCT reveals of man.

But, there was always a remnant of those who believed and obeyed God. And,
like Noah and his family, he saves them from destruction. The NT Bible
calls it obtaining salvation and eternal life. It is a most uplifting
belief for me.
<[Note to Kenny: How did the kangaroos get from Ararat to Australia after
the
flood?].

I'm not sure. Perhaps there was one continent at this time? Perhaps you
can tell me how kangaroos sprung up in Australia but were not able to
spring up in America or Turkey?

<Things quickly go south with mankind again but God
stays on as CEO, even demanding respect (burnt offerings seemed
to be the big thing at the time) from those who were most adversely
affected by his poor judgement.>

God's judgement was not poor. His creation was not bad. Man loved evil
more than good and wanted to do his own thing, what man wanted regardless
of what God said. It is the pot telling the potter how the pot creator is
to be; what he can and cannot do. It is a logical absurdity.

best wishes,

kenny

[From Kenny Kitzke (990212.1300EST)]

<Rick Marken (990207.1130)>

<3. Don't negotiate; destroy the opposition!

This is how God (via Moses) delt with Pharaoh. To God's credit,
he seemed to be opposed to slavery -- at least for Hebrews;-).
When God finally gets it into his all powerful agenda to to
free the Hebrews he proceeds by the use of naked force; he
threatens Pharaoh with plagues that will mainly hurt innocent
people. On top of this, whenever Pharoah starts to be inclined
toward giving in and freeing the Hebrews, God "hardens Pharoah
heart" so that God can go on punishing innocent people. Why, in
God's name, God hardens instead of softens Pharoah's heart is
beyond me. The God being described here is punitive (and a killer
of innocent people). God is a strong proponent of war and genocide
as a way to get whatone wants. On the topic of genocide, God makes
this wise observation: "Those that ye let remain [alive] of them
shall be as pricks in your eyes and thorns in your side and shall
vex you in the land wherein ye dwell" (Numbers 33:55) In other
words, make sure you kill everyone (man, woman and fetus) in the
places you take over or eventually someone will come back and
give you problems. Sound's like Microsoft's approach to business
competition. The Christians in Kosovo are also apparently trying
to apply this Biblical management principle in their country.>

You simply do not understand or accept the sovereignty and righteousness of
God. God cannot have communion with evil. There are no innocent men Rick
before God. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of our
incredible Creator.

Your lack of understanding and belief will not help you stand before God,
unless you receive mercy. I pray you do. You are a descendant of Adam and
are condemended to death (physical and spiritual) unless you want something
else.

<4. Have lots of rules, whether they make sense or not, and
demand blind adherence to them.

The famous 10 commandments are in Exodus (20:1-17). I hope
they are not listed in order of importance. If so, the second
most important commandment is "Thou shalt not sculpt"; is
sculpting (making graven images) really one of the top offenses
in God's "company"? This will be bad news for my Auntie Natalie
who has several large metal sculptures on display in public
places in LA and Japan. "Thou shalt not kill" is way down on
the list.>

The second commandment is not about sculpting. Graven images are those of
gods made by man used for worship. God is not an eagle or the sun. No one
except Jesus the Christ has seen God. Any other image is false and false
worship. There is but one God to worship. He is a jealous God.

Killing is way down on the list. Jesus blood can wash even that away if
one believes and repents. There is one unforgivable sin, denying the
presence of the Holy Spirit of God.

<I'm afrand that reading this Bible for management or moral lessons is just
not going to work for me.>

I can see that. I had some hope for you; still do. :sunglasses:

<Against the backdrop of my wimpy, relativist moral references, much about
the God of the Bible strikes me as just plain immoral.>

I think you'll have a chance to tell God himself what you think. I hope he
is smiling when you are done.

<For those who insist on getting their ideas about management and morality
from ancient tribal myths I recommed Homer's epics over the Torah any day.
They are certainly better poetry (though Ecclesiates and the sexy Song of
Solomon give Homer a run for his money).>

I love the Torah and obey all that applies to me. As far as your literarry
suggestions, thanks but I like a differnt book: the number one best seller
in the world. Someone likes it even though you scoff at the Bible. But,
then again, you are Rick and you are a PCT expert and you are always right.
Right?

Best wishes,

kenny

[From Bruce Gregory (990212.1621 EST)]

Kenny Kitzke (990212.1000EST)

His only management book is the Bible. He knows nothing
about PCT. His
company became the most profitable one in the Pittsburgh
Region. This is
the third client that has hit #1 since 1993.

Pity the Canaanites didn't have you as a consultant.

Bruce Gregory

[From Bruce Gregory (990212.1620 EST)]

Kenny Kitzke (990212.1100EST)

Christian managers learn that fighting God's plan is quite
futile. They
accept his will in life and in their business. Some even
become blessed
and rise to the top of the mountain, with or without PCT.
God may show
them mercy as he decides. It is not so much management you are not
schooled in, Rick, its the word of God you cannot understand.

Rick is not the only one. I do appreciate your imaginative story telling
however. You ability to read between the lines to arrive at a PC (if not
PCT) interpretation is impressive. "God's will" covers a multitude of
sins. In fact, it seems to cover them all. The fate of the Canaanites
was simply God's will, right? If you are a Canaanite I suppose you
should be comforted to know this. How about the Jews in Germany? God's
will no doubt. An appropriate fate for "Christ killers"?

Bruce Gregory

[From Bruce Gregory (990212.1648 EST)]

Kenny Kitzke (990212.1000EST)

God created man with free will. Man could choose to obey or
disobey his
Creator's will for him. When Adam disobeyed, the nature of
man changed
drastically. We all still suffer from Adam's original sin.

I like God's notion of freedom. You are free to do whatever you choose.
But if you choose something other than what God wants, you are road
kill. Sounds like the Godfather to me. I never realized how Bible-based
the Mafia is. If you go along with the Godfather his blessings will rain
upon you. No wonder you are so smug and self satisfied. You are a "made
man".

Bruce Gregory