MOL

[Dick_Robertson]

[From Dick Robertson,2008.09.25.1020CDT]

I’m really impressed.

Best,

Dick R

···

----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Wuwert JDWuwert@WSFCS.K12.NC.US
Date: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 7:06 pm
Subject: Re: MOL
To: CSGNET@LISTSERV.ILLINOIS.EDU

From Jim Wuwert 2008.09.23.1604

[From Bill Powers (2008.09.23.0534 MDT)]

This is to Jim Wuwert. How about an update, Jim, on how things have
sorted themselves out for you?

For me, I have just come to the conclusion that making abortion legal or illegal is really not the point of what I want. What I want is for people to stop having abortions. I accept that I do not and cannot control whether people do that or not. There was an article on our local news website today about abortion. The headline was misleading because they said that abortions have decreased overall–this due to a decrease in the population of the subgroup that tends to have the most abortions. With some subgroups the abortion rate increased. It is still a problem. 1.2 million abortions were committed in a single year. That is alot in my mind.

I don’t think focusing on making it illegal will really get us where I want it to go. I would like for 1.2 million to be zero. I think it is a larger task than just passing a piece of legislation–much like this financial meltdown that is taking place in this country. I think that as I focused on passing a law that created more conflict–but when I was able to step back and reflect on what I really wanted (eliminating abortions to zero), I then realized that this is so much bigger than a law.

For me, I see the conflict different. I think the pro-choice and pro-life people would benefit by stepping back and thinking about what they would really like in regards to abortion. I think deep down both sides want a reduction in the abortion rate and I think both would like to see it eliminated altogether. But, when we characterize each other as pro-choice or pro-life we really do not get anywhere. Meanwhile others are out contributing to the abortion rate while we are fighting with each other. Sounds like a lose/lose to me.

My resolution is let’s see what we can do to reduce this rate and let’s reevaluate our efforts every so often so we can make adjustments that will work and produce results that get us closer to zero. We may not ever hit zero, but why not try. To me trying to reduce the rate is much more important than passing a law. Just because I passed a law does not mean I actually tried to reduce the rate, which is what I really want.

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AN EQUAL OPPORTUNITY/AFFIRMATIVE ACTION EMPLOYER

[Jim_Wuwert]

From Jim Wuwert 2008.09.26.1927EST

[From Bill Powers (2008.09.24.1639 MDT)]

Jim, did you learn anything about ways to interact with others who are having disagreements?

Yes, I did. I think the best way to learn it is to do it and try it. The only drawback is in the fast paced world everybody wants a quick fix rather than taking the time out to do some serious reorganization. But, if they took the time to reorganize they would probably have more time and get things done faster. For me, once I was able to get at what I want, I could move forward. It seems that sometimes we would rather stay and argue rather than really work “it” out.

To take this a step further, has anyone done any research on what is happening in the brain as one is reorganizing? What’s going on inside? Has anyone done any research using the fMRI to chart brain activity? Just wondering where the latest brain research fits into PCT? Is it relevant? Is the brain research that is being conducted just the same old stuff as other psychological theories or is it uncovering things that are compatible with PCT? Is the fMRI even a reliable measure?

One of the hottest new areas of research in the social sciences is social neuroscience–combining neuroscience with psychology (neuropsychology) or with economics (neuroeconomics) or with ethics (neuroethics). Is this just fad or could it benefit the development and progression of PCT?

Doesn’t the brain play into reorganization and even conflict resolution?

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[Bill_Powers1]

[From Bill Powers (2008.09.27.0823 MDT)]

Jim Wuwert 2008.09.26.1927 EST –

Thanks, Jim. I guess I still have a little trouble believing that so
little effort on my part can lead to such big changes by someone else.
Obviously, you were the one who did all the work and I just pointed at
things here or there. Is that how it felt to you, too? What’s your
assessment of this approach? Do you think that the changes that occur are
just temporary, or will they last?

As to brain research, David Goldstein wanted to get into that, since he
has some pretty good EEG equipment, but it’s not that easy to organize a
meaningful research project, and one has to find the time and other
resources to do it right. At one point Tom Bourbon, who you don’t know,
had access to MRI equipment, but it was all tied up in an existing
program. I think work like that will be done, but first PCT has to gain
more legitimacy.

One of the hottest new areas of research in the social sciences
is social neuroscience–combining neuroscience with psychology
(neuropsychology) or with economics (neuroeconomics) or with ethics
(neuroethics). Is this just fad or could it benefit the
development and progression of PCT?

I think that area is more talk than substance. Showing that some little
areas of the brain light up when certain things go on doesn’t enlighten
me much. Where do these people think thought, experience, perception,
action, and all that take place? In Detroit?

EVERYTHING we know about takes place in the brain, even thinking about
brains and experiencing bodies.

Doesn’t the brain play into reorganization and even conflict
resolution?

It plays into EVERYTHING. You, in that brain you occupy, asked that
question. You, in your brain, taking light in through those two holes,
experience these neural signals that look like printed words to you. If
parts of your brain stop working, parts of your world of experience
disappear. Or you become unable to think, or reason, or speak, depending
on which parts go bad. Without a brain, we are pure awarenesses with
nothing to be aware of. I rather doubt, actually, that we would be
anything, but I can’t fit awareness into any of my models, so it just has
to float above it all until I can find a home for it.

Yeah, yeah, I know what Home you’re thinking of. I’m not. That’s just a
story.

[What’s wrong with saying “that’s just a story” when the other
side thinks it’s OK to say “That’s the truth, you poor ignorant
heathen?” As one of my favorite posters says, “I may disagree
with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it
even if you’re a raving space loon.”]

Best,

Bill P.

···

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[rsmarken]

[From Rick Marken (2008.09.27.0945)]

Bill Powers (2008.09.27.0823 MDT)]

Jim Wuwert 2008.09.26.1927 EST --

One of the hottest new areas of research in the social sciences is social
neuroscience

I think that area is more talk than substance.

I think it's worse than that. Neuroscience has become a substitute for
understanding behavioral phenomena. It's the personification of Mary's
"understandingness". It's where psychology has gone as it becomes
clear that its fundamental organizing principle -- the causal model --
is wrong. With neuroscience, fancy biological terms substitute for
models as an explanation of a behavioral or mental phenomenon. I was
at a talk a few months ago where a prominent researcher explained a
behavioral phenomenon in terms of two different areas of the brain
lighting up at different times. And all the big heavy hitter
researchers in the audience took this stuff seriously -- many of the
same people who poo poohed my models of purpose. I think the trend in
psychology toward neuroscience is a sign of the fact that it a
discipline at a dead end and has to rely on the impressive
technological developments in medical imaging to make it seem like it
is getting anywhere.

I actually think there has been some good work in neurophysiology and
that it is important for control models to be consistent with what is
known of the physiology of the brain and NS. But the stuff being done
now as behavioral neuroscience is pretty bad for the reasons I mention
above; it's letting observations of brain activity substitute for
models as explanations of behavioral phenomena.

Best

Rick

···

--
Richard S. Marken PhD
rsmarken@gmail.com

[Jim_Wuwert]

From Jim Wuwert 2008.09.29.1555EST

[From Bill Powers (2008.09.27.0823 MDT)]

Thanks, Jim. I guess I still have a little trouble believing that so little effort on my part can lead to such big changes by someone else. Obviously, you were the one who did all the work and I just pointed at things here or there. Is that how it felt to you, too? What’s your assessment of this approach? Do you think that the changes that occur are just temporary, or will they last?

I agree that you pointed to things here and there. However, I chose to go where you were and abide by the ground rules of you being interviewer and me being interviewee. Whomever was doing this would have to agree to stay in those roles. I think where much of the problem is is when people do not stay in their roles. We get outside of them and either perpetuate the conflict or just walk away and do nothing. Both of those approaches are ineffective long-term. Doing nothing can make things worst. Continuing to conflict can make things worst.

I like the approach of MOL–it’s much better than any theory I learned in grad school. It seems more effective too. I am frustrated with social science in that this is a good theory and it was left out-neglected-not viewed as important-yet it is the only theory that I have come across that takes in everything. It considers the whole being. It reflects biology and physiology. It’s amazing that we either bring people into “counsel” or bring them into a school to “teach” them, yet on many days we completely neglect the physiology of the person. We don’t consider it with management decisions nor do we consider it when writing policy. And then we wonder why things will not change or why we have a conflict with person X.

In some ways, I feel like I have been fed half-truths in studying social science. It is sending me into major reorganization. I am rethinking my perspective on psychology, counseling and education. It’s like going to the car dealer, asking for a blue honda accord–when you pick it up it looks blue and it looks like an accord, but when you get home and drive it around you find out that it is really pink and it is a chevy. It is completely different.

You asked me if I thought the changes would last. Not sure. I would hope so. Time will tell. I definitely believe that approaching a conflict using MOL is much more effective and deeper. I feel that it cuts to the soul of a person. I know that is risky language in this group. I feel like the process gets you to look at what you really believe. You can’t hide or fake it–not if you really consider the questions being asked. I like the depth that it helps a person get to (i.e. the thought behind the thought). In my mind that is deep.

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[Bill_Powers1]

[RFrom Bill Powers (2008.091636 MDT)]

Jim Wuwert 2008.09.29.1555EST

You asked me if I
thought the changes would last. Not sure. I would hope so. Time will
tell. I definitely believe that approaching a conflict using MOL is much
more effective and deeper. I feel that it cuts to the soul of a person. I
know that is risky language in this group. I feel like the process gets
you to look at what you really believe. You can’t hide or fake it–not if
you really consider the questions being asked. I like the depth that it
helps a person get to (i.e. the thought behind the thought). In my mind
that is deep.

You really know how to mke a theoretician happy. Thanks.

What you call the soul I call the Observer Self.

Best,

Bill P.

[Tim_Carey1]

[From Tim Carey (98901.2240]

I had an interesting session today with the 16 year old young man with
anger problems. At one point he told me that he had negative expectations
of almost everything. We chatted about this for a while and then he said
that he tended to look on the positive side of things. I asked him how he
made sense of these two statements and he said they were a contradiction.
As we chatted about this contradiction, I asked him whether he thought I
was looking for a "right" answer when I asked him questions. He said he was
and he said he found it really confusing when he said what he thought I
wanted to hear and then I would ask him more questions so he would think he
must have got the first answer wrong.

He looked really relieved when I explained to him that when I asked
questions, I was sincerely interested in finding out how he saw things, I
wasn't interested in the "right" answer. I think you had alluded to this in
an ealier post Bill, so it was interesting to see it come out in such a
definite way.

Regards,

Tim

[Bill_Powers1]

[From Bill Powers (980901.1326 MDT)]

I have my new desktop computer wrestled to the ground; it no longer
responds to every command with "It is safe to turn your computer off now."

Another couple of days and I'll be able to pay attention to simulations.

Tim Carey (980831.2040)]

By the end of the session she said that she felt the session had been
really helpful and that things had begun to change.

Hooray!

Best,

Bill P.

[Tim_Carey1]

[From Tim Carey (980904.0612)]

Yesterday I saw the woman who wants to learn some strategies to control her
children better. We had a really odd session. I started by outlining what I
saw as her options in terms of what I could provide for her. I explained
that we could look at specific strategies for how to manage her kids and I
also explained an MOL approach. Amazingly, she said she wanted the MOL
approach. We spent the session exploring what was concerning her, and
paradoxically, by the end of the session she had come up with some ways of
getting on better with her kids.

Regards,

Tim

[David1]

Sounds like this woman does not want others telling her what to do,
which is what I remember you said she said. The MOL, which is more of a
self-discovery approach with the help of the therapist, does not involve
advice giving so that it would suit her better.

The fact that she came up with some of her own ideas about how to
interact with her children in a more satisfying way suggests that the
MOL helped her view things differently.

If you did an MOL on the MOL session, you might help her learn some
things about herself which could be useful to her. It may be too soon.
And you may want to have more MOL success sessions.

Timothy A Carey wrote:

···

From: David Goldstein
Date: 9/5/98
Subject:Re:MOL [From Tim Carey (980904.0612)]

[From Tim Carey (980904.0612)]

Yesterday I saw the woman who wants to learn some strategies to control her
children better. We had a really odd session. I started by outlining what I
saw as her options in terms of what I could provide for her. I explained
that we could look at specific strategies for how to manage her kids and I
also explained an MOL approach. Amazingly, she said she wanted the MOL
approach. We spent the session exploring what was concerning her, and
paradoxically, by the end of the session she had come up with some ways of
getting on better with her kids.

Regards,

Tim

[Tim_Carey1]

[From Tim Carey (980823.1830)]

I saw two of my clients again today with some interesting results.

The first person I saw was the 15 year old boy who has anger control
problems. I had spent some time last week explaining to him that I would
not be determining the content of our sessions anymore, that I would leave
that up to him. When I saw him this week I asked him what he thought of
last week's session and he said that he found it much easier to talk last
week when he was in control of the content.

We chatted about a few things and to cut a long story short he eventually
said that he thought of himself as a "fat, useless, piece of crud". I asked
him about this and he said that he didn't really care that he thought that
about himself because he was sure things would get better eventually. When
I asked him how what he had just said (about not caring that he was a fat,
useless piece of crud) sounded to his own ears as he heard himself saying
it, he said it sounded like "mumbo jumbo". I asked him if it bothered him
to talk mumbo jumbo and he said he "hated it". He went on to say though
that it was easier to say this kind of stuff than to think about himself as
a fat useless piece of crud. He said when he thought about this he just got
really sad and angry and he didnt know how to change. This was a really
touching moment and I could feel my eyes getting moist. We seemed to have
kind of plateaued so I diverged for a while spent a bit of time explaining
the process I was attempting to follow and how sometimes things might seem
worse before they seemed better. He seemed really interested in this idea
and thoght this would be a good place to start next week.

The other guy I saw was the 20 year old male who used the "on the other
hand" pattern when he was speaking or planning things he was going to do.
The consequence of this was that he spent lots of time procrastinating. A
fortnight ago he had reported that he was making big changes but this week
he said he was back to procrastinating again. He described a few situations
where he was procrastinating and actually said that he felt "torn between
two things that he wants". We explored this a little and essentially most
situations seemed to come down to a choice of doing something that he
thought would help him live "happily ever after" or doing the other thing
which would see him "lying around doing nothing waiting to end it all". I
spoke to him about what it was like to have these kinds of things in his
head and he said it was "scary". His main concern was that he was worried
about his "mental stability". He said this as an almost off-hand comment
but it seemed to have more to it than that and when I chatted to him about
it, he changed the subject. At this point, thinking I was on to something
really important, I lapsed back into being a conventional psychologist and
really tried to pursue this "mental stability" idea. He, consequently,
became quieter and changed the topic more frequently. Needless to say I
learned a lot from this encounter.

I've videoed these two sessions so I'm looking forward to watching the
videos and reviewing my attentiveness and identifying areas I can improve
on.

It seems that it's taken ages to get to the point I seem to be at now with
these two young men but they have both had quite an extensive experience
with the mental health profession and it seems to have taken a long time to
get past the answers that they almost seemed to think they were "supposed"
to be saying. For the first time today I had a really strong sense that
what was being said was tapping into something that was actually going on
for these guys rather than giving me what I wanted to hear.

In my brief experience so far it seems that education about the process is
important in the beginning and also briefly revisiting this at the start of
each session. It's probably also important (at least in my head) to be very
explicit about who is in control of this process (they are). I know you've
said this before Bill but, when we appeared to reach a difficult bit it
seemed to make a real difference to remind them that they were the ones who
decided whether or not we spoke about whatever it was that had come up.

It was still tough at times to not want to try and "fix" them, but I think
I'm getting better at going up a level myself during the session when this
happens.

Anyway, that's enough rambling for now ...

Cheers,

Tim

[Bill_Powers1]

[From Bill Powers (980923.0857 MDT)]

Tim Carey (980823.1830)--

I saw two of my clients again today with some interesting results.

These reports are of great value, both as a record of how MOL can be made
to work, and as a diary of how it is to learn to use it. You're breaking
new ground. It all seems to be getting less hypothetical and more real.

Best,

Bill P.

[KENNETH_J_KITZKE1]

[From Kenny Kitzke (980824.0830EDT)]

<Tim Carey (980823.1830)>

Tim,

Thanks for sharing these MOL sessions. I'm hanging on every word. I'm
working up the nerve to try MOL counseling with a friend from 30 years ago,
who called me out of the blue, looking for help. He is broke, living with
his mother (they hate each other, fight every day) and he is HIV positive.
He sounds suicidal and talks like the patients you are seeing. He is
suspicious of everyone and bitter. I've been trying to establish trust
with him that I don't want anything from him and will not tell him anything
unless he asks. He has asked to get together again for lunch.

He seems to have too much pride to ask me for help. He seems to most want
sympathy; someone who cares about him. I'm a softy. I gave him $100 so he
could call me. He calls me sometimes three times a day (all expensive toll
calls which cause friction with his mother). He just called.

He is pursuing going to a VA hospice as we discussed. He was against this
as it implied he was seriously ill and it would limit his "freedom." He
kind of moved up a level in one discussion and saw that he could get a
number of things there that he wants that he can't get at home or at bars.

I said great, I'll come and visit you there. "Promise?", he said. Won't
that be better than talking by phone? Yes, it comforted him. But with
Tom, talk and reality are two different things. We'll just have to wait
and see. One of these days he'll have to reconcile his situation to
himself and admit he does not know what to do. Then, and only then, will I
try to help him find some peace and joy in a life gone awry.

I'm also having some health problems which has adversely affected my
ability to work and my liesure activities like reading my email as well.
I've downloaded some 300 posts in the past few days because I'm in so much
pain I can't even read them at my computer. However, any post on MOL, or
that is personal, I do try to read and respond briefly in my better
moments.

···

********************

BTW, to all of you that have wished me well, thank you. It is very
comforting. Next week I have doctor appointments to assess what has gone
wrong. I'm trying to stay optimistic while preparing for the worst.

I planned to be in San Antonio for the first two weeks in October. These
plans are somewhat speculative now as well. We are indeed as fragile as a
blade of grass. This is very scary for someone who has been blessed with
good health for 50 years. Since birth, I've visited a hospital only twice:
to have my tonsils taken out as a youth (remember being forced to eat
popsicles) and for a kidney stone that while it was painful and tramatic,
it all passed. I hope these problems will pass as well.

Sincerely,

Kenny

[Tim_Carey1]

[From Tim Carey (980825.0505)]

[From Kenny Kitzke (980824.0830EDT)]

Hi Kenny,

Thanks for your post and your kind words. It is a great concern to hear
about your health problems. You are in my thoughts. I hope everything works
out well for you.

With regard to your friend, he really sounds very troubled and given
everything he's been through he probably has every right to be suspicious.

Recently I was reviewing my MOL sessions on video and going through some of
Bill's old posts re MOL. I put together a list of guidelines (I'm a
compulsive list writer ;-)) that I'd like to be able to follow when I do
MOL. Some of the guidelines are probably pretty basic and this is certainly
not an exhaustive or definitive list. I keep the list on my wall and read
it every so often. All the ideas in the list come from Bill's posts. You
might find some of them helpful/interesting ....

1. Follow rather than lead

2. I'm not there to solve problems or sell anything

3. This is just an exploration .... the purpose is improved understanding

4. Be aware of my own expectations. Sometimes the best thing I can do is to
go up a level my self.

5. Stay more focussed - keep asking questions at the higher level once a
client goes up

6. Play dumb!!! Ask lots of questions for the client to clarify the meaning
of what he/she is saying.

7. It's the client's session NOT mine

8. Don't try and be clever

9. Relax and don't try so hard

10. Always aim for an "up" direction

11. Let the client know that this process will be different from others
he/she has been involved in and sometimes things might seem worse before
they seem better. Emphasise to the client that this is not about giving me
the right answer.

12. Get as much stuff out on the table as you can. Whenever you're stuck
ask for more details, another example, etc.

Your friend sounds lucky to have you around. I hope some of these ideas
might be helpful for you.

Cheers,

Tim

[Tim_Carey1]

[Tim Carey (981014.21.45)]

I had another session today with the 15 year old who has anger problems.
Most of the session went pretty well. He was able to describe with some
clarity what getting irritated was like for him. He described a bubbling
sensation in his chest and talked about some of the thoughts that go
through his head. After we had chatted about this for a while he said that
he just didn't what he was supposed to do. He didn't know whether he was
allowed to get angry anymore or how he was supposed to feel. This seemed to
be a really significant piece for him and being the bumbling clot that I am
in these sessions I got really excited and tried to push for some more
up-a-level stuff. I started asking "What do you think about not knowing...
" and stuff like that instead of just asking him to describe what it was
like. Pretty soon he had clammed up and said he didn't want to talk
anymore.

The only encouragement I have at the moment is that there's always next
week ....

Cheers,

Tim

[Bill_Powers1]

[From Bill Powers (981014.0737 MDT)]

Tim Carey (981014.21.45) --

He didn't know whether he was
allowed to get angry anymore or how he was supposed to feel. This seemed to
be a really significant piece for him and being the bumbling clot that I am
in these sessions I got really excited and tried to push for some more
up-a-level stuff. I started asking "What do you think about not knowing...
" and stuff like that instead of just asking him to describe what it was
like. Pretty soon he had clammed up and said he didn't want to talk
anymore.

The only encouragement I have at the moment is that there's always next
week ....

If I were running this show, I would start next week by saying "Last week I
got really excited about your progress and started pushing too hard, and
you clammed up on me. I don't blame you, and I'll try not to do it again,
OK? So how's it going this week?"

Oh, I'm sorry about the backwardness of the professors in Australia. Over
here all you ever hear them saying is "reference level, controlled
variable, comparison, action, closed loop ...". It gets very annoying.

Best,

Bill P.

···

Cheers,

Tim

[Tim_Carey1]

[From Tim Carey (981015.0535)]

[From Bill Powers (981014.0737 MDT)]

If I were running this show, I would start next week by saying "Last week

I

got really excited about your progress and started pushing too hard, and
you clammed up on me. I don't blame you, and I'll try not to do it again,
OK? So how's it going this week?"

Thanks Bill. I think he'd really appreciate something like that.

Oh, I'm sorry about the backwardness of the professors in Australia. Over
here all you ever hear them saying is "reference level, controlled
variable, comparison, action, closed loop ...". It gets very annoying.

Yep, I can imagine you'd get really ticked off. It's funny though, I get
ticked off for exactly the opposite reason

Cheers,

Tim

[David_Goldstein1]

Tim: After we had chatted about this for a while he said that
he just didn't [know] what he was supposed to do. He didn't know whether he
was allowed to get angry anymore or how he was supposed to feel.

I agree with you about not pushing but a 15-year-old may need some extra
help.

For example, Tell me more about not knowing what your supposed to do. Tell
me more about not being allowed to get angry. Tell me more about not
knowing how you are supposed to feel.

Another possibility: You just said.... As you said this, are you aware of
any you aware of any background stuff? [I assume he understands "background
stuff."

Another possiblity: You just said....I am having the background thought that
maybe you are worried about the possiblity of making some change in
yourself? I won't know how to act or feel if I change myself? Any of that
going on?

Keep on going.

···

From: David Goldstein
Subject: Re: MOL
Date: 10/14/98

[Tim_Carey1]

[From Tim Carey (981015.1450)]

From: David Goldstein <davidmg@SNIP.NET>

Keep on going.

Thanks for the suggestions David, they all sounded really useful.

Cheers,

Tim

[Tim_Carey1]

[From Tim Carey (981020.0620)]

I had what felt to me like my first "real" MOL session last night with one
of my clients. This client is the woman who has had significant anger
problems. She is 46 and says she has been to many therapists
(psychologists, psychiatrists, and a hypnotist) and has lost countless jobs
because of her anger. She said to me in the first session that she
"disrupts people's lives".

This was the 8th session I had with her. She is leaving the violent man she
has been in a relationship with for 4 years and has bought a house so she
and her daughter can live on their own. She said this is the first time in
her life since she was 15 that she hasn't had a relationship. Usually she
has what she called "lapovers" where she has the new man before she gets
rid of the old man.

She is still living at home with her current partner while she packs and
makes arrangements to move into the new house. I was quite worried about
her last week because the man was starting to get violent again. Well, she
came in this week and said that she hadn't had a problem with her partner.
Whenever he got angry at her she would just laugh and walk away. This has
never happened before in her life. Usually she gets angry too and a huge
fight follows. She said that this week because she wasn't getting angry
(and she said that she honestly didn't get angry ... the laughing wasn't a
pretend act) then her partner didn't stay angry for very long.

A few of the significant events from the session were: she described being
in conflict (and she actually used the word conflict) because she really
wanted to live on her own and at the same time she was frightened about
being lonely; she described her life at the moment as like being on a
see-saw; she said that she saw this time as an opportunity to renew her
vows to herself.

The most amazing part occurred when she told me that she felt like she was
losing a part of herself by leaving this guy. I just asked her a lot of
quesitons about that: what part, when did she feel like that, has she felt
like that before, what does it feel like, etc, etc. Eventually she sort of
stopped and sat back and said: "You know, I don't think I am losing a part
of myself, I think it's just the way I've been looking at it. I've been
focussing on the negative aspects, and I haven't been seeing the positive
parts of leaving. I think things would be better if I stayed focussed on
the positive parts of leaving".

This is a much abridged version of the session and it certainly wasn't as
clean or as straightforward as it might seem from my report, but this might
give you a flavor of what occurred.

Cheers,

Tim