Practical Business Use of PCT in a business environment

CSGnet Archive CSG2008
21

(Gavin Ritz 2008.03.02.16.09NZT)

[From Rick Marken (2008.03.01.1515 PST)]

Gavin Ritz (2008.03.02.10.15NZT) --

Ok where do I post the cheque?

Rick

Shhh. Let's handle this off line. Bill thinks there's something wrong

with people who take bribes;-)

I'd be hard to catch; first of all I live many hours ahead of you so I have
a good start if you believe Zeno's principle, plus I'm across the sea.

I have looked carefully at the levels, this is what I think.

The levels were proposed as a basis for further research. We don't
know for sure if those are the actual levels or even if there are
levels. The small amount of research we've is consistent with the idea
of levels and I have done some work to show that control of sequences
takes place at a higher level than control of transitions (movement)
which takes place at a higher level than control of configuration.

This is not inconsistent with other theories I've worked with. In fact
categories, sequences, programs, systems concepts repeat again at another
level of abstraction. I just use other words to describe them. Declarative
mental processing, cumulative mental processing, serial mental processing
and parallel mental processing. They are otherwise identical.

But I don't see what the levels have to do with what you are trying to
do. I don't even know what you are trying to do.

They actually have everything to do with it because this is where judgement,
discretion and decision making take place. I already have instruments that
measure those levels in PCT, designed from other models.

All I know is that
you don't think PCT can help you do it and I'm inclined to agree.

In this case PCT has really just confirmed what I have done is probably
robust. (Although most of what I have done is taken from other theories and
models). It always good to get confirmation from a totally different source.

And regards to the logic operators I would have been surprised to find any
other, because it really just Boolean logic (categories, sequences,
programs, systems concepts). What is good to find is the hierarchy as in
PCT, that adds another dimension, the relationships between them would be
interesting to confirm. Although I believe the logic operators are discrete.

Regards
Gavin

···

Best

Rick

--
Richard S. Marken PhD
rsmarken@gmail.com

22

[Form Rick Marken (2008.03.02.1100 PST)]

Gavin Ritz (2008.03.02.16.09NZT) --

I'd be hard to catch; first of all I live many hours ahead of you so I have
a good start if you believe Zeno's principle, plus I'm across the sea.

You're where I'd love to be. I've always though of New Zealand as a
lovely place to live and, except for their attraction for base
jumping, I've always thought of New Zealanders as a pretty decent lot.

This is not inconsistent with other theories I've worked with. In fact
categories, sequences, programs, systems concepts repeat again at another
level of abstraction. I just use other words to describe them. Declarative
mental processing, cumulative mental processing, serial mental processing
and parallel mental processing. They are otherwise identical.

I'm not quite sure that's true. A nice example (I think) of
controlling different types of perceptions is my "Hierarchy of
Perception and Control" demo at
http://www.mindreadings.com/ControlDemo/HP.html. The demo is based on
the PCT notion that higher level perceptions are controlled more
slowly than lower level ones. At the "Fast" setting you can control a
configuration (keep it a circle rather than a square) but not a
transition (direction of movement) and certainly not a sequence (small
medium large rather than small large medium). Only at the "Slow" speed
can you perceive (and this control) the sequence.

>But I don't see what the levels have to do with what you are trying to
>do. I don't even know what you are trying to do.

They actually have everything to do with it because this is where judgement,
discretion and decision making take place. I already have instruments that
measure those levels in PCT, designed from other models.

PCT shows that judgment, discretion and decision making take place at
_all_ levels of control. "Judgment" describes the, typically
unconscious, comparison component of a control loop, judging whether
the perception is above, below or at the reference. "Discretion"
describes coordinated control -- usually at higher levels -- where the
level at which on variables is controlled depends on the level at
which other systems want other variables controlled. "Decision making"
describes the conscious experience of being in conflict: should I do X
or Y. When there is no conflict, internal or external, there is no
sense of making decisions. The point is that that judgment,
discretion and decision making are quite different than the different
levels of perception and control in PCT.

>All I know is that
>you don't think PCT can help you do it and I'm inclined to agree.

In this case PCT has really just confirmed what I have done is probably
robust. (Although most of what I have done is taken from other theories and
models). It always good to get confirmation from a totally different source.

I think you're perceiving confirmation where there is none. But if it
makes you happy then go with it;-)

Best

Rick

···

--
Richard S. Marken PhD
rsmarken@gmail.com