RKC -- "FATIQUE"?

RKC -- "FATIQUE"?

<Bob Clark (950613.1718 EDT)>

To Bill Leach [950523.22:50 US Eastern Time Zone].

I was surprised by your introduction of the form "fatique," at first I
thought you were correcting my spelling -- but review of my copy of my post
showed otherwise. Perhaps you were using a shift of spelling to indicate a
change to emotional concepts and emotion-related terms? My dictionary does
not include this spelling. Neither does my Spell-Checker.

To me, the sensation I call "fatigue" is just that: a sensation. As with
other sensations, it may be associated with any of a variety of emotions --
a topic that has received little attention from the net. To me, this is a
very important omission.

The only discussion I know of is one by Bill Powers entitled "Emotion"
(1972). Reprinted in Living Control Systems II. In this paper, Bill
observes, "Emotions are well-known to have two components, one thought-like
and one sensation-like." A careful examination of one's own experiences
seems to me consistent with this view. Bill writes of a "feeling state" --
as a sort of general term for the combination of sensations alone.

The "fatigue" I report is, to me, just such a "feeling state." It appears
to have little, if any, related "cognitive state."

In my own case, with my background, I was more interested in observing what
was happening, and what rehab therapists did.

At this time, some nine months after the stroke (not yet fully recovered),
I can distinguish several forms of "fatigue."

I.A.
At first, my primary experience was simply "fatigue." My doctor reports
that this seems to be universal. I was totally unable to use the muscles
of my left side. This was not "tired muscles." That feels different, and
has been experienced many times in the past -- prior to the stroke. I
tried as hard as I could to move the muscle, or make the movement,
requested: NADA! After moving to another hospital due to availability of
therapists, and another week or ten days, one of the therapists pointed out
a "twitch" in "one" fiber in my biceps! This amazed me -- I hadn't felt a
thing in any muscle! This was clearly not "muscle fatigue" -- my muscles
did not respond. But I was using my brain as hard as I could trying to
make any movement.

Comment:
It seems that muscle action requires about as much input directly from the
brain -- via the neurons -- as from the muscle fibers themselves. It also
seems possible that each muscle fiber is operated by its own neuron! Thus
control is achieved by increasing/decreasing the number of fibers, rather
than the strength of stimulation! A separate feedback system for each
fiber! Could make a lot of sense!

I.B.
Another set of problems consisted of trying to do ordinary things without
using my left arm, hand, leg, etc. Try to button a shirt with one hand!
And many other ordinary things. This is a form of learning, not very
intellectual. Intrinsic Systems are not involved, so this does not fit the
formal definition of "Reorganization."

Comment:
Perhaps "Reorganization" should be re-defined as synonymous with
"learning." Then some other term should be used when Intrinsic Systems are
involved. "Negentropy" was once proposed for this application. At least
this is a rather different term -- not likely to be confused with the
formal meaning of "entropy."

II.
As my muscles began to respond, I was often asked, "Are you getting tired?"
Since I felt no indication of "being tired" from the muscle in question, I
said "no." It must have taken at least two, maybe three months before I
realized that my increased breathing indicated that I was "getting tired."
I also noticed that this was accompanied by decreasing strength and
accuracy of movement of the muscle in question. As my strength has
improved, I have gradually become more active at home. Eventually, another
couple of months, I found I could move some muscles to the point that they
reported becoming "tired."

III.
As I became more active in meetings, I found I would be very tired the next
day -- to the point I was sleeping much of the day. This is gradually
improving. This is neither muscle nor brain tiredness -- it clearly feels
different and recovery has a different pattern. I suggest that this may be
due to using up the reserves of the endocrine systems. When stimulated by
interactions with other people -- some form of public performance --
certainly several important glands (adrenal, thyroid, etc) are in action.
Their supplies can become depleted, and the recovery process is quite
different from that for brain and muscle!

THREE FORMS OF "FATIGUE"
I. "BRAIN FATIGUE" characterized by increased rate and depth of breathing,
and observed both in the presence and in the absence of muscle activity.
Fairly rapid recovery, minutes, not hours.

II. "MUSCLE FATIGUE" a direct perception from the muscle(s) in question
(probably due to accumulation of lactic acid -- a metabolic product -- in
the muscle). Recovery rather rapid, determined by time needed to wash out
the waste products. At least a few minutes, usually a few hours. With
over-use, may be "sore" a few days. Tendency to avoid further use of the
muscle(s) in question.

III. "GLAND FATIGUE" a general feeling of "tiredness" and desire for
"sleep." The details would doubtless differ depending on which glands are
the ones primarily depleted. Various emotions could be aroused, depending
on the assigned "explanation" for the feeling. This may have important
implications.

For the functioning person, these three forms will occur in various
combinations, depending on the situation. A boring lecture may result
largely in Brain Fatigue; vigorous exercise, Muscle Fatigue; an exciting
performance, Gland Fatigue. But they are usually mixed and hard to
distinguish.

Perhaps some of you may have some independent data to add to this topic.

Sincerely, Bob Clark

<[Bill Leach 950614.20:59 U.S. Eastern Time Zone]

<Bob Clark (950613.1718 EDT)>

As I should think would be abundantly clear to most by now... either I do
not use a spelling checker (correct conclusion) or the one that I use is
a suitable candidate for worst software ever written.

BTW, I should think that on a forum such as this one where most people
have strong convictions about consistent, repeatable causality that no
one would use a "Spell-Checker". Do you have some "strange" people
living in your area?

reorganization

I seriously doubt that a perception that one is suddenly not able to
operate a portion of one's own body would result in an increase in
intrinsic error.

Also, as I understand the current thinking about re-organization:

Sustained Intrinsic errors are undoubtedly perceived by the reoganization
system and result in error output from that system (assuming of course
that the intrinsic error level is above some possible deadband about the
reference).

The perception for the reorganization system is probably an integrating
type of input.

The perception for the reorganization system is also probably a "summing"
input, that is, multiple "small" errors that individually would not be
perceived as a disturbance, would be when taken together.

Reorganization probably has some degree of localization (the structure, I
think might even have been created by previous "monitoring" of the
results of reorganization).

Errors in all control systems may (and probably do) contribute to an
intrinsic perception.

discussion of experience

Nothing to contribute unfortunately (well maybe unfortunately -- I am
sure that most experiences that would allow me to provide "first hand"
descriptions are of a nature that I would sooner experience vicariously)
but found your discussion to be very interesting.

-bill