[UNKNOWN] Is attention subject to control of perception?

[From David Goldstein(2004.11.14.18:30 EST)]

[Bruce Nevin (11.13.2004 12:15 EST)]

Thanks for an interesting post.

There is a Psychologist, Les Fehmi, who has worked on the issues you are discussing for years. He has a website which discusses it: www.openfocus.com.

He talks about styles of attending and encourages a flexible open focus style. He identifies two dimensions of stye of attention. One dimension is narrow versus wide. The other is more absorbed (a person loses his/her sense of self) versus less absorbed. The styles of attention do correlate with the eeg. Dr. Fehmi has CS programs in which he teaches Open Focus and has designed eeg hardware to encourage Open Focus. His hardware monitors five sites on the scalp (FPz, Oz, T3, T4 and Cz). People are encouraged to increase the phase synchrony in the alpha range at these sites simultaneously.

In your post, you try to relate the eeg work you reference to pct. I have been thinking of this issue as well. The Open Focus exercises encourages one to be simulataneous aware at the lower levels in the hierarrchy in as many sensory modalities as possible. The body is used as an object of meditation. One is asked to imagine configurations (including surfaces and volumes) and relationships (distances between configurations). For example, Can you imagine the distance between one eye and the other eye? Can you imagine the distance between the space inside your throat and the space inside your nose? Can you imagine the surface area of the skin that makes up your hand?

The second dimension (absorbtion versus its opposite) seems to relate to the relationship between the Reorganization system and the hierrarchy. When one is not aware of the observer self, this is absorbtion. I can recall the experience of playing the piano in front of an audience in an absorbed way and then becoming aware of myself doing this. It is usually at the latter time that an error would occur.

Thanks again for raising these issues.

David

···

----- Original Message -----

From:
Bruce Nevin

To: CSGNET@listserv.uiuc.edu

Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 12:16 PM

Subject: [UNKNOWN] Is attention subject to control of perception?

[From Bruce Nevin (11.13.2004 12:15 EST)]
Paying attention is a learnable skill.
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/living/articles/2004/11/13/playing_their_way_to_improved_concentration/
“[P]ractice can teach a child what it feels like – and looks like – to pay attention.”
Some perceptions are being brought under control here. What perceptions?
It could be a perception of “concentrating”. It could be perceptions of various body states that accompany paying attention. If the former, the learned skill is completely transferrable to different contexts. If the latter, the portability of the skill depends upon how context-dependent the perceptions are.
Basic practices of meditation also have this purpose, and this effect. The context of meditation practice typically is controlled – quiet, sitting still, eliminating distractions. Yet the ability to focus attention appears to be transferred to uncontrolled contexts replete with distraction. This suggests that the skills that are learned and strengthened in meditation practice involve control of a perception of “concentrating” or of perceptions accompanying concentration that are not context-dependent.
They do say http://www.playattention.com/general-questions/#gen9 that transfer depends on assistance from the coach and the parents. Another commercial product: http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,40475,00.html
This is based on research by Joel Lubar at the University of Tennessee http://psychology.utk.edu/people/lubar.html and Col. Louis Csoka for the US Army. Lubar’s work dates from the early 1970s, and has been published in 25 journal articles and book chapters and in the book Behavioral Approaches to Neurology , Academic Press, 1981. He compiled a list of peer-reviewed publications on this at http://www.drakeinstitute.com/home.phtml/add/2002-07-08-185122/.

EEG measures depend upon “resonance” or synchronization of many neural systems within regions of the cortex.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=9341967&dopt=Abstract
“… resonant loops between neocortical columns of cells known as local, regional, and global resonances. These resonances determine the specific EEG frequencies and are often activated by groups of cells in the thalamus known as pacemakers. There are complex excitatory and inhibitory interactions within the cortex and between the cortex and the thalamus that allow these loops to operate and provide the basis for learning. Neurofeedback is a technique for modifying these resonant loops, and hence, modifying the neurophysiological and neurological basis for learning and for the management of a number of neurologically based disorders.”

Bill has disparaged this as equivalent to picking up RF emanations from the backplane of a computer. (Actually, spies have done exactly this. When I worked at BBN, I was told that trucks filled with equipment belonging to the USSR would very commonly “break down” on the highway near certain buildings in Langley, VA, and it would take a long time to get them back on the road again. Are there analogous attempts to factor simpler signals out of EEG records?)

But what is this resonance? Why should neural signals in many neurons become synchronized? How does this relate to the control of individual neural signals in control loops? Shouldn’t synchronization or resonance interfere with control?

According to a presentation on an Army website about Csoka’s stuff, www.internationalmta.org/2003/2003PowerPointFiles/A12-Cowan.ppt , their equipment detects the “brainwaves” from the “Executive Attention Network”. There is an inverse relation between alpha EEG signal and focus or concentration. In Barry Sterman’s EEG studies of Air Force pilots in B2 simulators, as they focussed on a particular aviation task, the alpha brainwave decreased. The more difficult the task, the greater the alpha suppression.

There was an alpha burst as focus ended, and then suppression as the next task began. This interspersed “microbreak” rest period is considered essential. “[T]here is evidence that this kind of cycling between concentration and the microbreak is a basic way in which the brain functions. For example, there are studies that show that when we read, there is a brief idling rhythm in the visual cortex when we come to the end of a line and move on to the next.” http://peakachievement.com/articles/Article%20-%20NasaAirForce/ARTICLE-air_force_and_nasa_research.htm
“[T]hese idling rhythms decrease right after a person is presented with a target to respond to, and then increase again when they finish processing their response to the stimulus. In the back of the brain, this idling rhythm was an 8-12 Hz. (alpha) burst that increased as they became more familiar with the task. As he looked at sites that were further forward in the brain, he saw that there was also an idling rhythm at 5 to 7 Hz” or theta.

Elsewhere (http://peakachievement.com/articles/Article%20-%20NasaAirForce/ARTICLE-air_force_and_nasa_research.htm ) instead of “alpha brainwaves” they refer to “idling rhythms in the parietal lobe”.

But is it alpha or theta that is reduced during concentration?

“[A]s I and others concentrated, the voltage output decreased across the board, at all frequencies.” http://peakachievement.com/articles/Article%20-%20NasaAirForce/ARTICLE-air_force_and_nasa_research.htm “Dr. Sterman had actually noticed the same thing, from about 5 to 15 Hz—all the frequencies that he measured—at virtually all the brainwave recording sites he tried. Technically, this is called “event related desynchronization”. In the frontal lobe, this suppression is followed by the return of the theta (5-7 Hz.) idling rhythm in about half a second, particularly after we see a target, rather than an unimportant control stimulus. When people learn to suppress the idling rhythms, their attention problems clear up.”

Here is what I think is the key insight out of this that they’re missing. It sounds like the synchronization or resonance that is measured as “brain waves” correlates with distraction, and that good control (corresponding with concentration) takes individual neurons out of resonance, weakening the net effect of a “brain wave”.

They make a distinction between concentration and alertness. The following is from the PPT presentation cited above:

Concentration: The degree of Single-pointed focus on a perception, thought, or image.
– Zooming in.
– Can be relaxed, very alert, or in-between.
– The “Zone”.

Alertness/Arousal: More intense stimulation, “on the edge”, excitement.
– Summoning resources to respond.
– Related to stimulation of the Reticular Activating System by many studies.
– Enhances emotion.
– Quick “burnout” if not conserved.

This seems to me to be an important distinction. In our discussions, we have not clearly made this distinction. We have talked of attention in relation to readiness for action (arousal) and as correlated with (perhaps caused or directed by) error. This is at odds with the experience of meditators. It may say more about distraction than about concentration of attention.

In sum, it appears to me that when you’re not concentrating on something, neurons within each region of the brain synchronize with one another. When you are concentrating on a task, individual neurons track sensory input and intention (reference input), and such signals differ from one neuron to another, taking them out of the resonance of synchronization with other neurons. The noise in the brain of neurons at play diminishes when you focus on a task. “Suppression” of “brainwaves” is a side effect, but by making it something that you can effect consciously, with “biofeedback” from the sensors in this helmet or visor, you do whatever it takes to diminish the side effect. The result is concentrating better.

      /Bruce Nevin

[From
Jason Gosnell, 2004.11.17 19:15 CST]

[David
Goldstein (2004.11.14.18:30 EST]

I
wanted to add some comments but haven’t had the time to do so. Related to
attention there is a Japanese style of psychotherapy called Morita Therapy that
makes use of this phenomenon. Shoma Morita was a Japanese psychiatrist in the
early 1900s. He would prescribe bed-rest to neurotic patients–probably
borrowing from Zen’s use of intensive meditation retreats–where they would have
to lie in bed for a week, they could get up to eat, they had no company, no
phones, TV, books, etc. They did have a psychiatrist but very little was said to
them by the doctor. His purpose was to expose the patient to their internal
suffering, including all of the avoided internal stimuli, and to naturally
produce the state of mind called “mushoju-shin.” This basically means that “the
peripheral aspect of consciousness (or attention) would open.”

He
found that neurotics tended to use a fixated attention style with a lot of
ruminative thinking taking up the space in the mind. They get locked in a
sensing–thinking circle with physcial symptoms frequently where they are
sensing experience, but from a distance–they are rejecting their experience by
evacuating momentarily into thought about the experience and the
attention shifts in a fixated style from the sensation to thought. There is a
circular fixation of sorts between attention, sensing and intellectualizing the
experience. They don’t really stay with an experience long enough to
investigate it accurately or allow it to pass on it’s own and the attention is
narrowing and fixating–it doesn’t expand to include the whole of experience. He
labelled this phenomenon with a Japanese name that I can’t
remember.

With
bed-rest, the attention would open, “mushoju-shin”, and around their ability to
“focus” would be a vast open space of awareness. So, they could easily
foreground an object of attention and allow an open, spacious background as
well. The person would feel a corresponding sense of space about their
being–not other worldly necessarily, but very present with the attention freed
up in all directions. Their ability to discern events clearly would increase as
well–emotions, sensations, etc. He considered this the normal and balanced
state of mind–flexible and adaptable to any circumstances. From here he would
teach them to function in this type of attention with several weeks of work
tasks and some verbal teachings. He reported a good success rate with
hypochondriacs and typical neurotics, and some with obsessives and
hysterics.

It
sounds the same, in essence, as the Open Focus work.

You
may already have read this, but there is a good book on this edited by Peg
Levine (a translation of Morita’s work) called “The True Nature of Anxiety-Based
Disorders.”

So
something about this quality of attention effects the whole organism? And
perhaps full attention to what is now, mindfulness, meditation or whatever you
call it facilitates this type of presence.

Jason
Gosnell

···

-----Original Message-----
From: David M. Goldstein
[mailto:davidmg@SNIP.NET]
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 6:56
AM
To: CSGNET@listserv.uiuc.edu
Subject: Re: [UNKNOWN] Is
attention subject to control of perception?

[From David Goldstein(2004.11.14.18:30
EST)]

[Bruce Nevin
(11.13.2004 12:15 EST)]

Thanks for an
interesting post.

There is a
Psychologist, Les Fehmi, who has worked on the issues you are discussing for
years. He has a website which discusses it: www.openfocus.com.

He talks
about styles of attending and encourages a flexible open focus style. He
identifies two dimensions of stye of attention. One dimension is narrow versus
wide. The other is more absorbed (a person loses his/her sense of self) versus
less absorbed. The styles of attention do correlate with the eeg. Dr. Fehmi
has CS programs in which he teaches Open Focus and has designed eeg
hardware to encourage Open Focus. His hardware monitors five sites on the
scalp (FPz, Oz, T3, T4 and Cz). People are encouraged to increase the phase
synchrony in the alpha range at these sites simultaneously.

In your post,
you try to relate the eeg work you reference to pct. I have been
thinking of this issue as well. The Open Focus exercises encourages one to be
simulataneous aware at the lower levels in the hierarrchy in as many sensory
modalities as possible. The body is used as an object of meditation. One is
asked to imagine configurations (including surfaces and volumes) and
relationships (distances between configurations). For example, Can you imagine
the distance between one eye and the other eye? Can you imagine the distance
between the space inside your throat and the space inside your nose? Can you
imagine the surface area of the skin that makes up your
hand?

The second
dimension (absorbtion versus its opposite) seems to relate to the relationship
between the Reorganization system and the hierrarchy. When one is not aware of
the observer self, this is absorbtion. I can recall the experience of playing
the piano in front of an audience in an absorbed way and then becoming aware
of myself doing this. It is usually at the latter time that an error would
occur.

Thanks again
for raising these issues.

David

----- Original Message -----

From:
Bruce Nevin

To: CSGNET@listserv.uiuc.edu

Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 12:16
PM

Subject: [UNKNOWN] Is attention subject
to control of perception?

[From Bruce Nevin (11.13.2004 12:15 EST)]
Paying
attention is a learnable skill.
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/living/articles/2004/11/13/playing_their_way_to_improved_concentration/
“[P]ractice
can teach a child what it feels like – and looks like – to pay
attention.”
Some perceptions are being brought under control here.
What perceptions?
It could be a perception of “concentrating”. It
could be perceptions of various body states that accompany paying attention.
If the former, the learned skill is completely transferrable to different
contexts. If the latter, the portability of the skill depends upon how
context-dependent the perceptions are.
Basic practices of meditation
also have this purpose, and this effect. The context of meditation practice
typically is controlled – quiet, sitting still, eliminating distractions.
Yet the ability to focus attention appears to be transferred to uncontrolled
contexts replete with distraction. This suggests that the skills that are
learned and strengthened in meditation practice involve control of a
perception of “concentrating” or of perceptions accompanying concentration
that are not context-dependent.
They do say http://www.playattention.com/general-questions/#gen9
that transfer depends on assistance from the coach and the parents. Another
commercial product: http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,40475,00.html
This
is based on research by Joel Lubar at the University of Tennessee http://psychology.utk.edu/people/lubar.html and Col.
Louis Csoka for the US Army. Lubar’s work dates from the early 1970s, and
has been published in 25 journal articles and book chapters and in the book
Behavioral Approaches to Neurology , Academic Press, 1981. He compiled
a list of peer-reviewed publications on this at http://www.drakeinstitute.com/home.phtml/add/2002-07-08-185122/.

EEG

measures depend upon “resonance” or synchronization of many neural systems
within regions of the cortex.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=9341967&dopt=Abstract
“…
resonant loops between neocortical columns of cells known as local,
regional, and global resonances. These resonances determine the specific EEG
frequencies and are often activated by groups of cells in the thalamus known
as pacemakers. There are complex excitatory and inhibitory interactions
within the cortex and between the cortex and the thalamus that allow these
loops to operate and provide the basis for learning. Neurofeedback is a
technique for modifying these resonant loops, and hence, modifying the
neurophysiological and neurological basis for learning and for the
management of a number of neurologically based disorders.”

Bill has

disparaged this as equivalent to picking up RF emanations from the backplane
of a computer. (Actually, spies have done exactly this. When I worked at
BBN, I was told that trucks filled with equipment belonging to the USSR
would very commonly “break down” on the highway near certain buildings in
Langley, VA, and it would take a long time to get them back on the road
again. Are there analogous attempts to factor simpler signals out of EEG
records?)

But what is this resonance? Why should neural signals in

many neurons become synchronized? How does this relate to the control of
individual neural signals in control loops? Shouldn’t synchronization or
resonance interfere with control?

According to a presentation on an

Army website about Csoka’s stuff, www.internationalmta.org/2003/2003PowerPointFiles/A12-Cowan.ppt ,
their equipment detects the “brainwaves” from the “Executive Attention
Network”. There is an inverse relation between alpha EEG signal and focus or
concentration. In Barry Sterman’s EEG studies of Air Force pilots in B2
simulators, as they focussed on a particular aviation task, the alpha
brainwave decreased. The more difficult the task, the greater the alpha
suppression.

There was an alpha burst as focus ended, and then

suppression as the next task began. This interspersed “microbreak” rest
period is considered essential. “[T]here is evidence that this kind of
cycling between concentration and the microbreak is a basic way in which the
brain functions. For example, there are studies that show that
when we read, there is a brief idling rhythm in the visual cortex when we
come to the end of a line and move on to the next.” http://peakachievement.com/articles/Article%20-%20NasaAirForce/ARTICLE-air_force_and_nasa_research.htm
“[T]hese idling rhythms decrease right after a
person is presented with a target to respond to, and then increase again
when they finish processing their response to the stimulus. In the
back of the brain, this idling rhythm was an 8-12 Hz. (alpha) burst that
increased as they became more familiar with the task. As he looked at
sites that were further forward in the brain, he saw that there was also an
idling rhythm at 5 to 7 Hz” or theta.

Elsewhere (http://peakachievement.com/articles/Article%20-%20NasaAirForce/ARTICLE-air_force_and_nasa_research.htm )
instead of “alpha brainwaves” they refer to “idling rhythms in the parietal
lobe”.

But is it alpha or theta that is reduced during

concentration?

"[A]s I and others concentrated, the voltage output

decreased across the board, at all frequencies." http://peakachievement.com/articles/Article%20-%20NasaAirForce/ARTICLE-air_force_and_nasa_research.htm “Dr. Sterman had actually noticed the same thing,
from about 5 to 15 Hz-all the frequencies that he measured-at virtually all
the brainwave recording sites he tried. Technically, this is called
“event related desynchronization”. In the frontal lobe, this
suppression is followed by the return of the theta (5-7 Hz.) idling rhythm
in about half a second, particularly after we see a target, rather than an
unimportant control stimulus. When people learn to suppress the idling
rhythms, their attention problems clear up.”

Here is what I think is

the key insight out of this that they’re missing. It sounds like the
synchronization or resonance that is measured as “brain waves” correlates
with distraction, and that good control (corresponding with concentration)
takes individual neurons out of resonance, weakening the net effect of a
“brain wave”.

They make a distinction between concentration and

alertness. The following is from the PPT presentation cited above:

Concentration:  The degree of Single-pointed focus on a

perception, thought, or
image.

  •       Zooming
    

in.

  •       Can be
    

relaxed, very alert, or
in-between.

  •       The
    

“Zone”.

Alertness/Arousal:  More intense stimulation, "on the

edge",
excitement.

  •       Summoning
    

resources to
respond.

  •       Related
    

to stimulation of the Reticular Activating System by many
studies.

  •       Enhances
    

emotion.

  •       Quick
    

“burnout” if not conserved.

This seems to me to be an important

distinction. In our discussions, we have not clearly made this distinction.
We have talked of attention in relation to readiness for action (arousal)
and as correlated with (perhaps caused or directed by) error. This is at
odds with the experience of meditators. It may say more about distraction
than about concentration of attention.

In sum, it appears to me that

when you’re not concentrating on something, neurons within each region of
the brain synchronize with one another. When you are concentrating on a
task, individual neurons track sensory input and intention (reference
input), and such signals differ from one neuron to another, taking them out
of the resonance of synchronization with other neurons. The noise in the
brain of neurons at play diminishes when you focus on a task. “Suppression”
of “brainwaves” is a side effect, but by making it something that you can
effect consciously, with “biofeedback” from the sensors in this helmet or
visor, you do whatever it takes to diminish the side effect. The result is
concentrating
better.

        /Bruce

Nevin

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[From Rick Marken (2004.11.18.0845)]

Jason Gosnell ( 2004.11.17 19:15 CST) --

I wanted to add some comments but haven't had the time to do so. Related to
attention there is a Japanese style of psychotherapy called Morita Therapy
that makes use of this phenomenon. Shoma Morita was a Japanese psychiatrist in
the early 1900s. He would prescribe bed-rest to neurotic patients--probably
borrowing from Zen's use of intensive meditation retreats--where they would
have to lie in bed for a week, they could get up to eat, they had no company,
no phones, TV, books, etc.

If this was done in the early 1900s I don't think it would have been hard to
keep people away from TV;-)

They did have a psychiatrist but very little was
said to them by the doctor. His purpose was to expose the patient to their
internal suffering, including all of the avoided internal stimuli, and to
naturally produce the state of mind called "mushoju-shin." This basically
means that "the peripheral aspect of consciousness (or attention) would open."

This seems similar to at least one aspect of the PCT approach to
psychotherapy called the Method of Levels (MOL). One aim of the method of
levels if is make a person aware of the internal conflict that is causing
them problems.

He found that neurotics tended to use a fixated attention style with a lot of
ruminative thinking taking up the space in the mind.

Yes. In MOL this would be a person who is fixated on the consequences of the
conflict (I want to do X but I can't) rather than on the conflict itself (I
want to do X but I also want to do Y, which is incompatible with doing X).
Of course, in PCT "doing" means "controlling for."

With bed-rest, the attention would open, "mushoju-shin", and around their
ability to "focus" would be a vast open space of awareness.

This sounds like "going up a level". The MOL describes a more efficient
procedure than bed rest aimed at helping a person "open their awareness" or
"go up a level" so that they become conscious of their conflict from the
point of view of the higher level systems that are creating the conflict (by
setting the conflicting goals for a lower level perceptual result).

So something about this quality of attention effects the whole organism? And
perhaps full attention to what is now, mindfulness, meditation or whatever you
call it facilitates this type of presence.

The PCT MOL has a different way of looking at this (and of talking about it)
but it sounds to me like Morita is talking about what in PCT is called
taking consciousness "up a level". I think MOL promises to get at the
essence of what makes all therapies work so that it will be possible to
eliminate the unnecessary components of therapies (like lying in bed for a
week) and, therefore, increase the efficiency of the therapeutic process.

Best

Rick

···

--
Richard S. Marken
MindReadings.com
Home: 310 474 0313
Cell: 310 729 1400

--------------------

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[From Jason Gosnell (2004 11.18.14.20)]
[Rick Marken (2004.11.18.0845)]

Rick--thanks for the response--you pointed out a few things for me, they
seem correct observations to me.

<Yes. In MOL this would be a person who is fixated on the consequences of
the
conflict (I want to do X but I can't) rather than on the conflict itself (I
want to do X but I also want to do Y, which is incompatible with doing X).
Of course, in PCT "doing" means "controlling for.">

<This sounds like "going up a level". The MOL describes a more efficient
procedure than bed rest aimed at helping a person "open their awareness" or
"go up a level" so that they become conscious of their conflict from the
point of view of the higher level systems that are creating the conflict (by
setting the conflicting goals for a lower level perceptual result).>

So, this goes back to the idea of being able to hold two things or more in
awareness as a unit? And, essentially not to be identified with the objects
of awareness--I mean "fused" with it so to speak. Allowing integration of
these two things and a resolution to emerge? Rather than staying locked down
on one aspect and essentially being "stuck." This is like refusing to change
even when it appears to be necessary to do so. Hanging on for dear life. If
so, I suppose the Gestalt Therapy method of going back and forth between the
two chairs--the two conflicts--is somewhat similar. In Morita Therapy there
is a teaching about accepting difficult emotions--not to avoid taking care
of your needs--but to, I think at least, accomodate what PCT refers to as
the re-organization process. So, this may be why they talk so much in that
therapy of accepting difficult emotions: Re-organization has some
difficulty, confusion, anxiety perhaps in it. I don't know...

<The PCT MOL has a different way of looking at this (and of talking about
it)
but it sounds to me like Morita is talking about what in PCT is called
taking consciousness "up a level". I think MOL promises to get at the
essence of what makes all therapies work so that it will be possible to
eliminate the unnecessary components of therapies (like lying in bed for a
week) and, therefore, increase the efficiency of the therapeutic process.>

I hope that PCT can do this. It certainly seems to have the foundation to do
so. I noticed this more after reading Dick Robertson's book EGOSTAT--as far
as practical applications for PCT. I do think that the approaches,
meditation, etc., could be more efficient with the right methods in place.
I'm new to this so I am just beginning to get it--I hope more clinicians
begin to try to understand it.

Thanks,

Jason Gosnell

···

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Marken [mailto:marken@MINDREADINGS.COM]
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 11:49 AM
To: CSGNET@listserv.uiuc.edu
Subject: Re: [UNKNOWN] Is attention subject to control of perception?

[From Rick Marken (2004.11.18.0845)]

Jason Gosnell ( 2004.11.17 19:15 CST) --

I wanted to add some comments but haven't had the time to do so. Related

to

attention there is a Japanese style of psychotherapy called Morita Therapy
that makes use of this phenomenon. Shoma Morita was a Japanese

psychiatrist in

the early 1900s. He would prescribe bed-rest to neurotic

patients--probably

borrowing from Zen's use of intensive meditation retreats--where they

would

have to lie in bed for a week, they could get up to eat, they had no

company,

no phones, TV, books, etc.

If this was done in the early 1900s I don't think it would have been hard to
keep people away from TV;-)

They did have a psychiatrist but very little was
said to them by the doctor. His purpose was to expose the patient to their
internal suffering, including all of the avoided internal stimuli, and to
naturally produce the state of mind called "mushoju-shin." This basically
means that "the peripheral aspect of consciousness (or attention) would

open."

This seems similar to at least one aspect of the PCT approach to
psychotherapy called the Method of Levels (MOL). One aim of the method of
levels if is make a person aware of the internal conflict that is causing
them problems.

He found that neurotics tended to use a fixated attention style with a lot

of

ruminative thinking taking up the space in the mind.

Yes. In MOL this would be a person who is fixated on the consequences of the
conflict (I want to do X but I can't) rather than on the conflict itself (I
want to do X but I also want to do Y, which is incompatible with doing X).
Of course, in PCT "doing" means "controlling for."

With bed-rest, the attention would open, "mushoju-shin", and around their
ability to "focus" would be a vast open space of awareness.

This sounds like "going up a level". The MOL describes a more efficient
procedure than bed rest aimed at helping a person "open their awareness" or
"go up a level" so that they become conscious of their conflict from the
point of view of the higher level systems that are creating the conflict (by
setting the conflicting goals for a lower level perceptual result).

So something about this quality of attention effects the whole organism?

And

perhaps full attention to what is now, mindfulness, meditation or whatever

you

call it facilitates this type of presence.

The PCT MOL has a different way of looking at this (and of talking about it)
but it sounds to me like Morita is talking about what in PCT is called
taking consciousness "up a level". I think MOL promises to get at the
essence of what makes all therapies work so that it will be possible to
eliminate the unnecessary components of therapies (like lying in bed for a
week) and, therefore, increase the efficiency of the therapeutic process.

Best

Rick

--
Richard S. Marken
MindReadings.com
Home: 310 474 0313
Cell: 310 729 1400

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[From Rick Marken (2004.11.19.1040)]

Jason Gosnell (2004 11.18.14.20)--

Rick--thanks for the response--you pointed out a few things for me, they
seem correct observations to me.

Thank you! That's nice to hear.

Best

Rick

···

--
Richard S. Marken
MindReadings.com
Home: 310 474 0313
Cell: 310 729 1400

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