Laurel versus yanni

[From Bruce Abbott (2018.05.19.2038 EDT)]

Here in the States there has been a lot of attention given to an online dictionary audio clip that pronounces the word “laurel.” About half of those listening to the clip hear the speaker say “laurel” and the other half hears “yanni.” Apparently, what one perceives depends on how well you can hear certain frequencies of the auditory spectrum, the frequency spectrum of the device that produces the sound, and perhaps the background noises that may be present in the environment of the listener. This provides an excellent example of how different individuals may perceive the “same” environmental input differently.

You can try an demo that allows you to change the spectrum so that you can hear either word here:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/05/16/upshot/audio-clip-yanny-laurel-debate.html

Bruce

[Rick Marken 2018-05-20_13:51:59]

Bruce Abbott (2018.05.19.2038 EDT)]

Â

BA: Here in the States there has been a lot of attention given to an online dictionary audio clip that pronounces the word “laurel.â€? About half of those listening to the clip hear the speaker say “laurelâ€? and the other half hears “yanni.â€? Apparently, what one perceives depends on how well you can hear certain frequencies of the auditory spectrum, the frequency spectrum of the device that produces the sound, and perhaps the background noises that may be present in the environment of the listener. This provides an excellent example of how different individuals may perceive the “sameâ€? environmental input differently.

RM: I was going to agree but then I did the demo you sent and I'm pretty sure that different environmental inputs are the basis of the different words heard in this "illusion". Â

 BA: You can try an demo that allows you to change the spectrum so that you can hear either word here:

<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.nytimes.com_interactive_2018_05_16_upshot_audio-2Dclip-2Dyanny-2Dlaurel-2Ddebate.html&d=DwMFAg&c=OCIEmEwdEq_aNlsP4fF3gFqSN-E3mlr2t9JcDdfOZag&r=G2rjwc9SjlT6Blyc8su_Md8P_xOsOTRMJ5teQVBC2qU&m=R1RSvphfUdql81pof3QPJ2ROKVhu69k8-AmyCzKiH8I&s=QxGh58X-O9unWKbwp-nYoUkojilgD57UDqvs-kcErIw&e=&gt;&gt; We Made a Tool So You Can Hear Both Yanny and Laurel - The New York Times

RM: I presume that as I move the pointer from the center to the left, toward "Laurel", or right, toward "Yanny", I am moving toward a low or high pass filtered version of the sound sample, respectively. I am now able to adjust the pointer so that the filtering allows me to hear both "Laurel" and "Yanny" at the same time. I presume this is because the acoustic (environmental) basis for both perceptions is present in the waveform and so both can be perceived simultaneously when I adjust the pointer so that I am listening to a fairly wide band version of the sound sample. The spectrograms suggest that this is the case.Â
RM: So the "Laurel/Yanny" illusion is not really a demonstration of the same environmental input being perceived differently. I think a better demonstration of that is my "What is size" demo (<http://www.mindreadings.com/ControlDemo/Size.html&gt;http://www.mindreadings.com/ControlDemo/Size.html\) where the same environmental variables (the lines on the computer screen) can be perceived as the perimeter or area of a rectangle. But it is interesting that I was able to control for hearing both Laurel and Yanni at the same time by adjusting the filtering so that it was slightly toward low pass. I think that's because we are more sensitive to higher than lower frequencies.Â
BestÂ
Rick

···

--
Richard S. MarkenÂ
"Perfection is achieved not when you have nothing more to add, but when you
have nothing left to take away.�
                --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

[Bruce Nevin 2018-05-20_19:12:27 ET]

···

On Sat, May 19, 2018 at 8:40 PM, “Bruce Abbott” csgnet@lists.illinois.edu wrote:

[From Bruce Abbott (2018.05.19.2038 EDT)]

Â

Here in the States there has been a lot of attention given to an online dictionary audio clip that pronounces the word “laurel.â€? About half of those listening to the clip hear the speaker say “laurelâ€? and the other half hears “yanni.â€? Apparently, what one perceives depends on how well you can hear certain frequencies of the auditory spectrum, the frequency spectrum of the device that produces the sound, and perhaps the background noises that may be present in the environment of the listener. This provides an excellent example of how different individuals may perceive the “sameâ€? environmental input differently.

Â

You can try an demo that allows you to change the spectrum so that you can hear either word here:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/05/16/upshot/audio-clip-yanny-laurel-debate.html

Â

Bruce

[Bruce Nevin 2018-05-20_20:25:08 ET]

The output from the vocabulary website through a computer’s speaker was re-recorded by a student on their cellphone. Changes in the sound spectrum are made it ambiguous.

Here are three spectrogram images from the NYT page:

Laurel (presumably a relatively clean output from the vocabulary website)

The ambiguous dub made on a cellphone held up to a computer speakerÂ

The NYT approximation of “yanny,” made by combining parts of two words on the vocabulary website, “Yangtzeâ€? and “uncanny.â€?Â

I can’t vouch for how well they clipped and matched the “ya” of “Yangtze” and the “anny” of “uncanny.” But you can clearly see that in fact in the dub you cannot so clearly see the features that are visible in either the image above it or the image below it. This is a visual representation of ambiguity in the auditory signal.Â

Grounding this in our theory, as I understand its application to speech perception: given the sounds represented by the first image, perceptual input functions for initial L fire much more strongly than those for initial Y, and given the sounds represented by the third image, conversely, perceptual input functions for initial Y fire much more strongly than those for initial L; and so on for the medial R vs. N and for the vowels. But given the muddied signal represented by the second image, both fire.Â

In “Laurel”, the intensity of sound energy (pulsation of the air) is relatively attenuated (more damped)Â at higher frequencies and relatively stronger at lower frequencies, and in “Yanny” the converse is true, lower frequencies are weaker and higher frequencies stronger. Differences in capacity for perceiving higher and lower frequencies play a role. Most people lose ability to hear higher frequencies as they age. In some, the right ear is more affected; I speculate e.g. about men leaning into their work with power tools held in their right hand. However that may be, you may find interesting subjective differences in your own perceptions with the NYT slider demo, listening first with one ear and then with the other.

I hear a different consonant when I push the slider all the way over to the right, neither the L of laurel nor the Y of yanny, and I hear a different consonant in the middle, neither the R of laurel nor the N of yanny. What do you hear there?Â

Each vertical striation corresponds to one pulse of the vocal folds, but the articulated movement of the vocal folds does not produce a pure sine wave. Like a square wave, it produces a fundamental frequency (the pitch) and many harmonics. Height on the vertical dimension corresponds to higher and lower frequencies. The fundamental frequency (pitch) is at the bottom, and multiplies of that (its harmonics) are progressively higher. The oral cavity damps some frequencies and resonates with others, and which are damped and which are resonated is determined by the changing shape created by the jaw, tongue, and lips. So we move our jaw, tongue, and lips (and other articulators) to control the changing relative strengths of harmonics of the fundamental frequency as means of hearing ourselves speak.

There’s a nice tutorial on how to read sound spectrograms here:

https://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~robh/howto.html

···

On Sun, May 20, 2018 at 4:55 PM, Richard Marken csgnet@lists.illinois.edu wrote:

[Rick Marken 2018-05-20_13:51:59]

Bruce Abbott (2018.05.19.2038 EDT)]

Â

BA: Here in the States there has been a lot of attention given to an online dictionary audio clip that pronounces the word “laurel.â€? About half of those listening to the clip hear the speaker say “laurelâ€? and the other half hears “yanni.â€? Apparently, what one perceives depends on how well you can hear certain frequencies of the auditory spectrum, the frequency spectrum of the device that produces the sound, and perhaps the background noises that may be present in the environment of the listener. This provides an excellent example of how different individuals may perceive the “sameâ€? environmental input differently.

RM: I was going to agree but then I did the demo you sent and I’m pretty sure that different environmental inputs are the basis of the different words heard in this “illusion”. Â

 BA: You can try an demo that allows you to change the spectrum so that you can hear either word here:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/05/16/upshot/audio-clip-yanny-laurel-debate.html

RM: I presume that as I move the pointer from the center to the left, toward “Laurel”, or right, toward “Yanny”, I am moving toward a low or high pass filtered version of the sound sample, respectively. I am now able to adjust the pointer so that the filtering allows me to hear both “Laurel” and “Yanny” at the same time. I presume this is because the acoustic (environmental) basis for both perceptions is present in the waveform and so both can be perceived simultaneously when I adjust the pointer so that I am listening to a fairly wide band version of the sound sample. The spectrograms suggest that this is the case.Â

RM: So the “Laurel/Yanny” illusion is not really a demonstration of the same environmental input being perceived differently. I think a better demonstration of that is my “What is size” demo (http://www.mindreadings.com/ControlDemo/Size.html) where the same environmental variables (the lines on the computer screen) can be perceived as the perimeter or area of a rectangle. But it is interesting that I was able to control for hearing both Laurel and Yanni at the same time by adjusting the filtering so that it was slightly toward low pass. I think that’s because we are more sensitive to higher than lower frequencies.Â

BestÂ

Rick


Richard S. MarkenÂ

"Perfection is achieved not when you have nothing more to add, but when you
have nothing left to take away.�
                --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

image447.png

···

[Rick Marken 2018-05-20_18:38:23]

[Bruce Abbott (2018.05.20.2025 EDT)]

BA: … This provides an excellent example of how different individuals may perceive the “sameâ€? environmental input differently.

RM: I was going to agree but then I did the demo you sent and I’m pretty sure that different environmental inputs are the basis of the different words heard in this “illusion”. Â

Â

BA: You are disagreeing with a claim I did not make, as a careful read of my paragraph above should make clear.

RM: Well, I keep reading it and I keep coming up with you saying that the "“Laurel/Yanni” demo is an example of how different individuals perceive the same environmental input differently. I think the demo shows that the environmental input for “Laurel” is in the low range and that for “Yanni” is in the high range of the frequency spectrum of the sound sample.Â

Â

BA: The demo manipulates the auditory spectrum, so obviously it is NOT a demonstration of the SAME environmental input being perceived differently. What IS a demonstration of the SAME environmental input being perceived differently (the claim I DID make)  is seen when different individuals listen to the SAME auditory input: About half perceive “laurelâ€? and the rest, “yanni.â€?Â

RM: I think I see. Your “SAME environmental input” is the unfiltered sound sample (which I believe would be the one in the NY Times demo where the pointer is in the center?). My " SAME environmental input" refers to the low and high frequency components of this sound sample, which are the inputs to the perceptual functions that produce the perceptions of Laurel versus Yanny.Â

RM: I thought you were saying that the Laurel/Yanny illusion was an auditory analog of the type of visual illusion shown here:

RM: Here the exact same environmental input – the lines that make up the drawing – can be seen in two different ways – as an old woman or a young lady. But this is not the situation in the Laurel/Yanni “illusion”. Indeed, the Laurel/Yanni phenomenon is not reallyeven an illusion. The visual analog to Laurel/Yanni would be something like this:

YanniÂ

Laurel

RM: The “SAME environmental input” is the two words, Yanni and Laurel, presented simultaneously. But people who lack the ability to sense low (red) frequencies will see only Yanni and people who lack the ability to sense high (blue) frequencies will see only Laurel and people who can sense both frequencies will see both Yanni and Laurel.Â

BA: This difference in perception may result from differences between individuals in their sensitivity to different sound frequencies: Those who are most sensitive to lower frequencies hear “laurel,â€? whereas those who are most sensitive to higher frequencies hear “yanni.â€? The demo supports this hypothesis by showing that changing the frequency spectrum from emphasizing lower frequencies toward emphasizing higher frequencies does indeed change one’s perception of the word, as expected if those individual differences arise from differences in sensitivity to low versus high auditory frequencies.

RM: Exactly. All I was saying was that the perceptions of Yanni and Laurel are based on different (not the same) environment inputs – low frequency sound inputs for Laurel and high frequency sound inputs for Yanni – even though both are present in the same sound sample.Â

Best

Rick


Richard S. MarkenÂ

"Perfection is achieved not when you have nothing more to add, but when you
have nothing left to take away.�
                --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

[Bruce Nevin 2018-05-21_09:48:45 ET]

As is commonly the case, you’re both right.

Some people hear the low end better than the high end, and vice versa. The slider lets you simulate what it sounds like to a person whose hearing caracteristics differ from yours. Hence, the demo simulates “how different individuals perceive the same environmental input differently”, but is not an example of this (for any one listener) .

image447.png

···

On Sun, May 20, 2018 at 9:38 PM, Richard Marken csgnet@lists.illinois.edu wrote:

[Rick Marken 2018-05-20_18:38:23]

[Bruce Abbott (2018.05.20.2025 EDT)]

BA: … This provides an excellent example of how different individuals may perceive the “sameâ€? environmental input differently.

RM: I was going to agree but then I did the demo you sent and I’m pretty sure that different environmental inputs are the basis of the different words heard in this “illusion”. Â

Â

BA: You are disagreeing with a claim I did not make, as a careful read of my paragraph above should make clear.

RM: Well, I keep reading it and I keep coming up with you saying that the "“Laurel/Yanni” demo is an example of how different individuals perceive the same environmental input differently. I think the demo shows that the environmental input for “Laurel” is in the low range and that for “Yanni” is in the high range of the frequency spectrum of the sound sample.Â

Â

BA: The demo manipulates the auditory spectrum, so obviously it is NOT a demonstration of the SAME environmental input being perceived differently. What IS a demonstration of the SAME environmental input being perceived differently (the claim I DID make)  is seen when different individuals listen to the SAME auditory input: About half perceive “laurelâ€? and the rest, “yanni.â€?Â

RM: I think I see. Your “SAME environmental input” is the unfiltered sound sample (which I believe would be the one in the NY Times demo where the pointer is in the center?). My " SAME environmental input" refers to the low and high frequency components of this sound sample, which are the inputs to the perceptual functions that produce the perceptions of Laurel versus Yanny.Â

RM: I thought you were saying that the Laurel/Yanny illusion was an auditory analog of the type of visual illusion shown here:

RM: Here the exact same environmental input – the lines that make up the drawing – can be seen in two different ways – as an old woman or a young lady. But this is not the situation in the Laurel/Yanni “illusion”. Indeed, the Laurel/Yanni phenomenon is not reallyeven an illusion. The visual analog to Laurel/Yanni would be something like this:

YanniÂ

Laurel

RM: The “SAME environmental input” is the two words, Yanni and Laurel, presented simultaneously. But people who lack the ability to sense low (red) frequencies will see only Yanni and people who lack the ability to sense high (blue) frequencies will see only Laurel and people who can sense both frequencies will see both Yanni and Laurel.Â

BA: This difference in perception may result from differences between individuals in their sensitivity to different sound frequencies: Those who are most sensitive to lower frequencies hear “laurel,â€? whereas those who are most sensitive to higher frequencies hear “yanni.â€? The demo supports this hypothesis by showing that changing the frequency spectrum from emphasizing lower frequencies toward emphasizing higher frequencies does indeed change one’s perception of the word, as expected if those individual differences arise from differences in sensitivity to low versus high auditory frequencies.

RM: Exactly. All I was saying was that the perceptions of Yanni and Laurel are based on different (not the same) environment inputs – low frequency sound inputs for Laurel and high frequency sound inputs for Yanni – even though both are present in the same sound sample.Â

Best

Rick


Richard S. MarkenÂ

"Perfection is achieved not when you have nothing more to add, but when you
have nothing left to take away.�
                --Antoine de Saint-Exupery