Metaphors and S-R thinking

[From Bruce Abbott (951025.1045 EST)]

Bruce Abbott (951014.1550 EST)

Bill Powers (951015.0945 MDT)

I do hope you still plan to read Bowlby, especially Volume 1 (Attachment),
because Bowlby comes about as close as anyone to expressing my view of brain
and behavior . . .

I've started reading the Bowlby materials and have skimmed through all
the volumes once, with more detailed reading of Vol 1 on Attachment. I
can see why you recommended it -- he really made an attempt to get away
from the less defensible aspects of Freud's ideas and to substitute
control theory as a different paradigm. It's too bad, in a way, that
Bowlby and I couldn't have got together in the 1950s and 60s when he was
picking up all this stuff about control theory. He really had a pretty
good grasp of the principles, but he didn't know what to do with them
beyond saying that organisms control for outcomes and don't just produce
behavior open-loop. Unfortunately, just as he was getting revved up to
write these books, all this control theory stuff went out of favor. I
don't suppose that Bowlby made much more headway with introducing
control theory after that than I did, although he did a lot of other
work for which he was deservedly recognized.

I'll comment more on the net.

Bill, I hope you have not given up reading Bowlby; what you had to say thus
far could have been extracted from Chapter 1, which simply sets up Bowlby's
approach without getting into the real nitty-gritty of it. Regarding my
defense of the term "imprinting," you [Bill Powers (951024.1010 MDT)] have
offered the following commentary:

This whole way of framing the observations shows only that you are up to
your eyeballs in a particular theoretical frame of reference which is so
ingrained that you don't even recognize theoretical statements when you
are making them. Everything you are saying sounds completely reasonable
to you, I'm sure, and I'm also sure that you can't understand why most
of the PCTers on this net find your descriptions doggedly biased in
favor of a non-PCT world view. Speak up, PCTers, am I right about that?

You have made a similar case against Bowlby's term "attachment," which
labels the same general phenomenon by reference to a different set of
observations. Because I am basically elaborating Bowlby's approach, what
you have to say about my descriptions being "doggedly biased in favor of a
non-PCT world view" would apply with equal force to Bowlby. Therefore, it
would be of considerable interest to see just what Bowlby has to say. If
his adopting such terms as imprinting and attachment reveals and maintains a
deep-seated S-R world view, as you claim, that will become apparent enough
in his theoretical analysis. Here is a sample of Bowlby's thinking:

    Perhaps the simplest method of organising behaviour that has to change in
    a specified way over time is by means of a chain, each link of which is a
    behavioral system. When this is done behaviour proceeds in the correct
    sequence because the effects produced by the action of one behavioural
    system, when fed back centrally, not only terminate that system but also
    activate the system next in the chain. As a result one activity stops
    and another starts.

    The effects produced by the first activity may be registered by
    proprioceptive sense organs or by exteroceptive ones, or by both
    together. An example of a behavioural sequence that is dependent on
    proprioceptive feedback is walking. Here the end of the first phase
    of alternating action is registered proprioceptively and, when fed back
    to the controlling system, simultaneously inhibits the first phase of
    movement and initiates the second. Most of the more complex and
    interesting instinctive sequences, however, are dependent on feedback
    from exteroceptors, notably eyes, ears, and nose. Many examples are
    given in the ethological literature. The reactions of a foraging
    honey bee provide a good illustration: links in the chain of responses
    have been identified by experimental work using models.

    The collection of honey by a honey bee starts with a visually controlled
    behavioural system; on perceiving, often at a considerable distance, a
    flower-shape of colour yellow or blue the bee flies towards it until it
    reaches within 1 cm. The next link in the chain is controlled by
    olfactory stimuli: on perceiving an odour that lies within a certain
    range the bee settles on the flower and explores its shape. The third
    link is controlled by tactile stimuli: on perceiving structures of a
    certain shape the bee inserts its mouth parts and begins to suck. In
    the ordinary course of events the collection of nectar results. Thus
    the behavioural equipment of the bee is so organised that within the
    environment of evolutionary adaptedness behaviour resulting from the
    action of one behavioural system leads to a situation which simultaneously
    terminates that system and activates the next in a series of steps such
    that the final result is a gathering of nectar.

    Many intricate and beautifully adapted sequences of behaviour are now
    known to be due to systems organised in simple chains of this kind. Yet,
    remarkable though the achievement of systems so organised may be, such an
    orgainsation is subject to grave limitations. For example, the whole
    organisation fails in its purpose if the action of one link in the chain
    miscarries. If, because of a chemical spray, the flower's odour cannot
    be detected, the second behavioural system in the chain is not activated
    and the bee moves elsewhere without finding the honey to which is came
    so near. Thus, only when the environment conforms exactly to the
    environment of evolutionary adaptedness does each of the behavioural
    systems in the chain produce its effect and the whole organisation lead
    to behaviour of survival value. As in other chains, the strength of the
    organisation is no greater than that if its weakest link.

    There are, however, ways by which a chain-linked organisation of
    behavioural systems can be made more flexible. For example, at any
    point in it a chain can have one or more alternative links so that,
    whenever activation of the first of a set of alternative behavioural
    systems fails to achieve results that activate the succeeding system in
    the chain, one of the other systems of the set becomes active. In this
    way it may happen that the same outcome is attained by any of a number
    of alternative behaviours.

    A further point to remember regarding the potentialities of chains is
    that any particular link in a chain can be a behavioural system of any
    degree of complexity. Thus, whilst the chain itself is always strung
    together without goal-correction, any or even all of the individual
    links in it can be a goal-corrected system. . . .
      John Bowlby (1969) _Attachment and Loss. Part 1: Attachment._ Pp. 76-77.

So, based on this little exerpt, what do you think? Was Bowlby a closet S-R
theorist or a man whose ideas were highly compatible with the view that
behavior is the control of perception?

Secondly, where in the label "imprinting" do you see any evidence of S-R
thinking? Thirdly, I get the impression that you are strongly inclined to
reject the idea that the chick's brain houses a mechanism whose function is
to identify a particular complex of perceptions to serve as a target from
which to compute references for a number of innately-organized
survival-critical perceptual control systems. Do you see the possible
existence of such systems as incompatible with PCT, or are you simply
disposed to believe that the control systems whose actions are observed in
attachment behavior emerge through reorganization?

Regards,

Bruce

<[Bill Leach 951026.00:09 U.S. Eastern Time Zone]

[Bruce Abbott (951025.1045 EST)]

Perhaps the simplest method of organising behaviour that has to change
in a specified way over time is by means of a chain, each link of which
is a behavioral system. When this is done behaviour proceeds in the
correct sequence because the effects produced by the action of one
behavioural system, when fed back centrally, not only terminate that
system but also activate the system next in the chain. As a result one
activity stops and another starts.

At least one problem with this description is that it seems to imply that
once this external trigger occurs that the particular "chain link" runs
to completion by generating a fixed output.

In the next paragraph quoted he says "Here the end of the first phase of
_alternating action_ is registered proprioceptively and, ..."

To me this reads as though phase one is to output a certain amount of
output and when this output has been detected to have taken place then
the next phase begins. While this is quite close to the case, it seems
to be missing the idea that the "output" or "action" is itself a control
of perception.

So to me, what I perceive Bowlby as saying is that environmental stimulus
triggers an output. When the output occurs (somehow), this changes the
perception in some discrete manner at some discrete time which then
triggers the generation of the next output.

To me, it reads as very close but also "missing by a mile." It is not,
again to me, as close as William James.

His, "complex chaining" again appear to me to be "canned generated
outputs" that are "selected" by environmental stimulus as opposed to
continous control system operation attempting to match perception to
reference.

The closing quote containing "Thus, whilst the chain itself is always
strung together without _goal-correction, ..." is particularly "damning"
as far as a control system view. Every control loop has a "goal" and it
is always the same... make the perception match the reference.

-bill

[From Bruce Abbott (951026.0940 EST)]

Bill Leach 951026.00:09 U.S. Eastern Time Zone]

[Bruce Abbott (951025.1045 EST)]

Perhaps the simplest method of organising behaviour that has to change
in a specified way over time is by means of a chain, each link of which
is a behavioral system. When this is done behaviour proceeds in the
correct sequence because the effects produced by the action of one
behavioural system, when fed back centrally, not only terminate that
system but also activate the system next in the chain. As a result one
activity stops and another starts.

At least one problem with this description is that it seems to imply that
once this external trigger occurs that the particular "chain link" runs
to completion by generating a fixed output.

Bowlby explicitly states elsewhere his view that the links in a chain can be
of any complexity, and may include fixed-action (i.e., S-R) and/or
goal-corrected (i.e., ECU) elements. What brings the next link of the chain
into action is the bringing of the prior link's system to a particular
state, whether by simple unguided action whose completion is signaled by
sense receptors or by action of an ECU bringing its input to reference.

In the next paragraph quoted he says "Here the end of the first phase of
_alternating action_ is registered proprioceptively and, ..."

To me this reads as though phase one is to output a certain amount of
output and when this output has been detected to have taken place then
the next phase begins. While this is quite close to the case, it seems
to be missing the idea that the "output" or "action" is itself a control
of perception.

Bowlby is talking about the alternating pattern of muscle contraction during
walking, in which completion of one phase (lifting one leg, swinging it
forward, setting it down, and shifting weight onto that leg) leads through
proprioceptive feedback to the beginning of its alternate phase (similar
movement of the other leg); he is concerned here only to illustrate that
some behaviors occur in a cyclic pattern, in which the completion of one
phase provides the starting conditions for the next. He is not here
attempting to provide a detailed description of the system's operation.
Thus he only speaks about that part of the action relevant to the problem of
sequencing.

His, "complex chaining" again appear to me to be "canned generated
outputs" that are "selected" by environmental stimulus as opposed to
continous control system operation attempting to match perception to
reference.

You can force that interpretation if you wish to, and I agree that the
language Bowlby often uses to describe what he has in mind may sound that
way. Engineers at the time this was written (and indeed, even today) use
such language to describe how their engineered control systems work, talking
about the system's output rather than its input. But in a control system,
the two are the same, so there is nothing technically "wrong" about the
description.

The closing quote containing "Thus, whilst the chain itself is always
strung together without _goal-correction, ..." is particularly "damning"
as far as a control system view. Every control loop has a "goal" and it
is always the same... make the perception match the reference.

Bowlby considers several possible organizations whereby an organized
sequence of behavior occurs. The chain is the simplest, and it is defined
by the fact that, although each link in the chain may be an ECU, there is no
higher-level system organizing the links to pursue a higher-level goal. It
is a "flat" structure. A bit later (on the next page, actually) he
describes a more flexible organization which, borrowing from Miller et al.,
he calls a "plan." The plan is organized hierarchically, with the
higher-level system organizing the lower-level ones into a sequence so as to
carry out the plan. The plan itself is goal-corrected, in contrast to the
chain, which is not.

Now, what's "damning" about a chain?

Regards,

Bruce

<[Bill Leach 951026.19:22 U.S. Eastern Time Zone]

[Bruce Abbott (951026.0940 EST)]

I almost wished I had waited until my next "online" session. Your
posting that followed the one to which I commented contained some (I
think) impressive quotes from Bowlby.

The "damning" part was the idea that any closed loop negative feedback
control system could function without a goal (ie: reference).

Their indeed may be "open loop" systems where such a manner of discussion
would be correct (for instance, does the heart "pacemaker" system
actually sense the direct effect of the heart muscles or does it just
apply a fixed signal and assume that complete contraction is appropriate
at all times?).

-bill