Re[4]: Are Cultures Control Systems?

[From Chris Cherpas (980319.1014 PT)]

Bruce Nevin (980318.1807 EST) --

Yet environmental effects created by other people controlling perceptions
(the effects and the perceptions alike called language and culture) seem to
be as fixed attributes of the environment as any boulder,...

Chris Cherpas (980318.1528 PT)--

Maybe for you.

Bruce Nevin (980318.2227 EST) --

What I mean by this is not e.g. the meaning of "I kicked a rock" but the
utterance, the auditory event,...

I guess boulders just seem more of a stable part of my environment
than utterances. But, are you saying utterances about boulders have more
fixed attributes than other kinds of statements? Actually, I rarely
encounter boulders, so I bring little expertise to the situation.

These are observable facts, subject to Test, not subjective judgements
that apply to me and not to you.

Just a nit, but I think facts are subjective judgements (perceptions)
too, as are the results of the Test, but I do subjectively judge them
differently than non-facts. The "same" facts that apply to me,
and also apply to you, are still the same in only some respects and
different in others.

I'm sure you meant something by your objection, but I think probably it was
based on a different interpretation of what I said.

Could be. I have enough trouble figuring out what I say, let alone
what you say, but commenting on what you say is at least a form of practice.

Best regards,