From Tom Bourbon [940527.1325]
[From Rick Marken (940527.0820)]
. . .
Oded Maler (940526)--
I just want to note that when the control systems are more complex,
and when they are embedded in a social/organizational context, the
meaning of energy and loop-gain are not as simple. You can say to
your wife something very nasty, or insult someone in public, that
will have much stronger effect then, say, mild pushing which is
more costly energetically. The same goes for social organization:
you can order the killing/execution of a person by a phone call or
by signing a document if you are in the correct position.
Rick:
This is getting ridiculous; I agree with everything you say these days ;-).
Careful, Rick! You will lose your reputation as the bad boy of csg-l. ;-))
This is an excellent point. One person's loop gain (such as a dictator's)
can become terrifyingly (or wonderfully -- especially of you are that person)
large when many people have adopted a goal of selecting their own goals based
You have both lost me, guys. When we talk baout (and calculate) loop gain,
aren't we talking more about the tightness of control than about the
measured energy expended. Is a person who uses power steering to help keep
a car in the desired position relative to the sides of the road controlling
any less tightly than a person in a car without power assisted steering?
The latter is _certainly_ expending more energy than the former, but how
would that lead to a conclusion that the latter is controlling with higher
loop gain?
Does issuing a death sentence by fax or e-mail or presing a red button
necessarily imply lower loop gain than standing someone against the wall
and pulling the trigger yourself?
Have I missed the point(s) on which the two of you agreed?
Later,
Tom
P.S. Oded, will you be in Wales?
···
on what that one person (the dictator) says.