[Martin Taylor 2016.12.22.15.09]
Killing (or maybe slightly inconveniencing) two birds with one stone...
[Eetu Pikkarainen 2016-12-19]
Thank you, very interesting. I think I partially understood. Have you (or Kent) written any more detailed paper or draft about these with more examples and examples about their use in your research?
Yes, but these are not yet publicly available.
How would you define the relationship of CEV to these four conpcepts?
The CEV might perhaps be considered an atenfel, as it is a link in the path between the output of an ECU and its perceptual input function, but it does not have one important property of an atenfel. The CEV has been called "the controlled quantity" from the viewpoint of an experimenter or outside observer. Changes in its value are what control is about, whereas an atenfel is usually considered to be a means of performing control (of the controlled variable). So I usually prefer not to think of the CEV as belonging to any of the classes: atenfel, molenfel, atenex, or molenex.
Is nexus always a concrete something which can offer (transitory) links for different situations?
No. But it's easier to describe when one uses a concrete example. I think two prime examples of non-concrete atenexes are language and money, both of which are completely intengible (pieces of paper or metal are not money, but collective control can give them a property that allows people to use them as atenfels for buying and selling. that property, rather than other aspects of the physical manifestation, is money). Both language and money can be used for control of an indescribably large number of different perceptions. The authority of a manager is another example, since s/he and others can use it in controlling a wide variety of perceptions.
Example of molenfel/molenex was nice. What could be a respective exaample of atomic cases?
The magnifying property of a lens, which allows finer perception of and therefore easier control of tiny objects.
As an atenex, the magnifying glass can be placed on a stack of paper to prevent it from blowing away, which would create error in a controlled perception of having those papers easily to hand. Or it could be used in a demonstration of the fragility of glass by a teacher of materials science who controls a perception of the students' understanding of different material properties. Or it could be used sideways to bang a small nail into soft wood. Or ... but you get the idea.
[From Erling Jorgensen (2016.12.21 1445 EST)]
[EJ] I remain agnostic as to the use of these terms until I understand them better. I'm not sure I follow the distinction you & Kent are making between 'atomic' and 'molecular'. It initially seems to me that most 'atomic' feedback links could be decomposed into constituent parts, making them in essence 'molecular'.
I'm not sure what you mean by the question. My understanding of "atomic" is that it serves as a singular link that might have other links in sequence with it in the path, as, for example, someone using the magnifying glass might also be using the fine holding property of small tweezers when manipulating a tiny object. A molenfel, however, requires the two properties in question to be used together, neither being useful in controlling that particular perception without the other. But I said that already, so I know it doesn't answer your question.
I am also not clear why a distinction is made between a 'link' and a 'nexus'.
They are in different domains of discourse, like the nodes and links of a network but more so. An atenex is an environmental stability such as a physical object, the meaning of a word, or the authority of a judge. One of the properties of an atenex is either actually being used in the environmental feedback path of some controlled perception, or potentially could be. An atenfel is a property used in control of a variety of different perceptions. Insofar as a particular link is in the feedback path of one controlled perception, if it is simultaneously in the feedback path of another I suppose it might be called an atenex, but since the link simply does not exist unless there is a functioning control loop, it can't be a potential atenex. The colour of a paint swatch could be used in any number of colour comparisons by different people at the same time, but they don't interfere, and I call that a "Catalytic unlimited" atenfel rather than an atenex (see below).
Again, it initially seems to me that many 'links' could assist with control in differing directions or with differing perceptions. So, conceptually, wouldn't they each be considered a 'nexus' of sorts.
I would say that the property that is used as a link in a functioning or imagined control loop can be used in the control of many perceptions, but except in the case mentioned above, the link cannot. When two loops use the same link at the same time, I would think that conflict is quite likely. But maybe it needs a rethink.
I have a classification of atenfels that might help a bit. I distinguish "Resource" and "Catalytic" types. A "Resource" type is changed or depleted by being used. For example, if a cook uses some salt when controlling his perception of the taste of his food, there is less salt for the next occasion. A Catalytic type is unchanged and undepleted by being used. The colour of a paint swatch used to control the colour of paint being bought for a job is undepleted by being used for any number of jobs by any number of people. But a catalytic atenfel might have limits on the number of simultaneous uses. A spoon, for example, can be used unchanged over thousands of meals, but can be used by only one person at a time to control for perceiving a spoonful of soup in the mouth. The spoon's "holding food" property is a "Catalytic Limited" atenfel. In contrast, a big paint swatch can be used by several people at the same time to match some other coloured thing, and a bridge can be used by many people at the same time to cross a river. I call them "Catalytic unlimited" atenfels.
On the full classification, I call the CEV an atenfel of its own type, all others being "Path" type atenfels. So the magnification property of a lens is "Path Catalytic Limited". Usually in my own mind, I think only of "Path" atenfels as the default, and include the CEV explicitly when it seems useful to do so.
I don't know if any of his gets at the kinds of questions in your minds, I hope it does.